February 20, 2020, 02:36:22 AM

Author Topic: Season 2011 - 2012  (Read 281781 times)

Offline Ageing Stick Insect

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #660 on: January 03, 2012, 10:16:31 PM »
Just for the record! He leaves Gerrard, Bellers and Maxi on the bench. Now that's crime against footy. Congrats City to your 3-0 or 4-1 victory. Your best contributer to the game? That's easy, Kenny Dalglish. I'm willing to bet two weeks of hanging in shame Spearing will get sent off. He isn't up to these kind of games yet (if ever).
I'll hold my hands up and say you were right Martin. But I'm fed up with all the negativity on this forum so I won't be around for a while.

Quite frankly I'm fed up with people rubbishing certain players and calling for the manager to be sacked. If this is meant to the the new Liverpool Way you can bloody well keep it!
Cheers,
Ray



Offline the dude abides

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #661 on: January 03, 2012, 10:27:26 PM »
I'm fed up with all the negativity on this forum so I won't be around for a while.

Quite frankly I'm fed up with people rubbishing certain players and calling for the manager to be sacked.

remind me if I'm wrong here, but you were happy to see Rafa sacked, right?

and as fans, are we supposed to ignore 112 million quid spent last year, and the fact we have not advanced one-iota nearer the the top 4 spots in the league.  As I said since September, we are playing top 8 level football most of the time.  With some luck, we may finish top 6.  That is about it.

And are we supposed to ignore the FA's report and laud the knee-jerk defence of racist outbursts. 

this is not the Liverpool I knew and grew up loving.

Still like you Ray.  And still wanna chink beer bottles here and get drunk. 

But I will defend myself. 
In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Juan

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #662 on: January 03, 2012, 10:31:11 PM »
But there you go playing crap like Maxi and Henderson who contributes next to nothing.

Martin above is a comment of yours after the Blackburn game and below is a quote from just a few minutes ago. I'm confused. Do you want Kenny to play Maxi or leave him on the bench? He cant do both. Could you be one of those fans who will fault him no matter what decision he makes?

Same with Downing, offering nothing nothing nothing while Maxi rots on the bench.

Offline Martinmarx

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #663 on: January 03, 2012, 10:32:19 PM »
I'll hold my hands up and say you were right Martin. But I'm fed up with all the negativity on this forum so I won't be around for a while.

Quite frankly I'm fed up with people rubbishing certain players and calling for the manager to be sacked. If this is meant to the the new Liverpool Way you can bloody well keep it!

Sorry to hear that Ray mate, but it's hard to be positive when old farts like myself with surgical precision game in and game out can tell how the game will pan out before it even started.

Henderson keeps strolling the park passing it sideways and backwards to the nearest player. Offers no physical presence, no movement, no nothing. Yet he's probably the single Liverpool midfielder who played the most number of minutes in the PL.

Downing, misses chance after chance and contributed only a handful of decent crosses and then I'm being generous.

At the same time we have players like Bellers, Maxi and Kuijt who rots on the bench despite contributing, if not goals, movement, tempo and pace to our game.

Also, Kenny's playing formations he doesn't have the personell for further making it difficult for the players to establish a gameplay.

I'm sorry Ray, but nothing would please me more than to have something positive to say.

Can't see us beat both Arsenal and Chelsea to 4th and that's not me being negative for the sake of it, but because any other analysis would be extremly unrealistic and void of reason.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2012, 10:36:06 PM by Martinmarx »
The modest Oracle of the Anfield Road Forum sometimes mistaken for Judas Iscariot.

Offline Martinmarx

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #664 on: January 03, 2012, 10:34:32 PM »
Martin above is a comment of yours after the Blackburn game and below is a quote from just a few minutes ago. I'm confused. Do you want Kenny to play Maxi or leave him on the bench? He cant do both. Could you be one of those fans who will fault him no matter what decision he makes?

I stand by my comment Maxi contributed nothing against Rovers as he almost never do against "lesser" sides. He's a given in games against topsides do.
The modest Oracle of the Anfield Road Forum sometimes mistaken for Judas Iscariot.

Offline the dude abides

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #665 on: January 03, 2012, 10:40:23 PM »
it's only 5.30pm here and I am due up at a friend's house at 8pm.

but after pretty much a dry Xmas and new year period (2 tiny glasses of red wine and half a dozen beers), I am tempted to open a bottle of red wine and drown my sorrows.

you're all welcome.
wish you were on skype.  What is it about free that annoys you all.   :P
In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Juan

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #666 on: January 03, 2012, 10:52:48 PM »
I'll hold my hands up and say you were right Martin. But I'm fed up with all the negativity on this forum so I won't be around for a while.

Quite frankly I'm fed up with people rubbishing certain players and calling for the manager to be sacked. If this is meant to the the new Liverpool Way you can bloody well keep it!

Ray dont let the negativity drive you away from the forum. There are plenty of optimists on here recognise that Liverpool are in the process of building for the furure again. Its going to be a slow process and mistakes will be made along the way. As well as that we will be competing against 5 other very good teams so 4th is never going to be guaranteed. Look at Man City. They have spent hundreds of millions for the last number of years but this is only their first year in the Premier League. There are plenty of fans out there who will give Kenny and players time. When Henrys plan finally bears some success at least you know you wont be just jumping on the bandwagon. So stick around and keep the posts coming!

Offline the dude abides

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #667 on: January 03, 2012, 10:59:58 PM »
would be a poorer place without Ray.

But there will always be some degree or other, of negativity. 

Heck, look at me, I managed to stick around despite the endless negativity, and abuse, of Rafa Benitez, his signings and his strategy.

 
In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Juan

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #668 on: January 03, 2012, 11:06:08 PM »
I stand by my comment Maxi contributed nothing against Rovers as he almost never do against "lesser" sides. He's a given in games against topsides do.

Martin thats a weak attempt to explain your point. Are you suggesting we leave Maxi on the bench for 28 games a season and only play him against the other top 5 or if not who do you suggest we should be playing him against? Hes either good enough or not. To suggest Kenny should hand pick the games hes going to start Maxi in is ridiculous. Should Kenny tell him in August altogether what premier league games he should expect to start for the season.

For me those two conflicting points show how fickle and irrational some of your points can be. Basically you want Kenny gone at all costs and are willing to use any reason possible to justify why he should go.

Offline Martinmarx

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #669 on: January 03, 2012, 11:07:05 PM »
Look at Man City. They have spent hundreds of millions for the last number of years but this is only their first year in the Premier League.

Too bad they, just like Spurs, didn't misplace them like we did or we'd actually have a chance at top 5. Not negativity, simple truth really.
The modest Oracle of the Anfield Road Forum sometimes mistaken for Judas Iscariot.

Offline Martinmarx

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #670 on: January 03, 2012, 11:09:11 PM »
Martin thats a weak attempt to explain your point. Are you suggesting we leave Maxi on the bench for 28 games a season and only play him against the other top 5 or if not who do you suggest we should be playing him against? Hes either good enough or not. To suggest Kenny should hand pick the games hes going to start Maxi in is ridiculous. Should Kenny tell him in August altogether what premier league games he should expect to start for the season.

For me those two conflicting points show how fickle and irrational some of your points can be. Basically you want Kenny gone at all costs and are willing to use any reason possible to justify why he should go.

I am glad it pleases you not all of my arguments are rock solid. Unfortunately my overall analysis is and it'll prove in time how utterly naive you were to think this was just a "transitional phase". No CL footy on this side of 2015 I tell you. For that to happen we need a manager able to sign good enough players, pick his best formation and his best team. Our current manager failed all these three criteria and there's strong evidence to that fact.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2012, 11:10:57 PM by Martinmarx »
The modest Oracle of the Anfield Road Forum sometimes mistaken for Judas Iscariot.

Offline Juan

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #671 on: January 03, 2012, 11:17:52 PM »

would be a poorer place without Ray.

But there will always be some degree or other, of negativity. 

Heck, look at me, I managed to stick around despite the endless negativity, and abuse, of Rafa Benitez, his signings and his strategy.

Agreed Dude it would be a poorer place without Ray.

On Rafa Dude I was also a huge fan. There were certain areas of his management style that I didnt like but I was gutted to see him go. I thought he could have done a huge amount with this club had he been given the right finances. Saying that though Dude do you not feel its time to move on from the Rafa era. He was sacked by a different regime. The fact that the club haemoraged money and had a huge over paid under talented squad during his era probably means someone like John Henry wont consider hiring him again. I also dont think they would like to take on his political side.  Anyway my point is I dont know why you would continue to compare Kennys reign to Rafas because they are under such different circumstances it will be impossible to ever compare accurately. You will never be able to give Kenny a decent chance if you keep looking back to Rafa.

Offline the dude abides

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #672 on: January 03, 2012, 11:20:07 PM »
For me those two conflicting points show how fickle and irrational some of your points can be.

I agree with you on that Maxi issue/contradictory quotes, Juan.

But let me make a wider point.

The people who are lost and dazzled in the glare of Kenny, the legend, will have to at some point set down the communion wine and realise that they are worshipping a false God.

The hypocrisy is astounding, in their ill-advised worship.

Rafa took us to two CL finals and we pretty much played in the CL every year.   He falls short once, and you all want him sacked.

And yet, the same benchmark does not apply to Kenny.....why?  He apparently needs more time (and lots more money). 

Rafa made the very best of the resources that he had to call upon.  The same cannot be said of Kenny.

Was there some form of ísm against Rafa? 
In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline the dude abides

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #673 on: January 03, 2012, 11:31:15 PM »
The fact that the club haemoraged money and had a huge over paid under talented squad during Rafa's era probably means someone like John Henry wont consider hiring him again.

I don't accept that for a minute, Juan.

the little englanders at the Daily Hail and that Laaawton columnist had it in for Rafa, during those final 18 months.  Aided and abetted by Mr and Mrs Liverpool, and their big media mate at the News of the Tur.d.  And regular fans bought their drivel, hook line and sinker.

It's a bit rich talking about Rafa's squad as being huge and overpaid, when we see Kenny shelling out 112 million quid these past 12 months.....and no doubt much more to come over the next season or two.

Rafa had to often wheel and deal.  And whilst I admired the fact that (unlike Houllier) his pride allowed him to admit a mistake early on and sell a player quickly on.......I thought he did a little too much wheeling and dealing.....continuity/consistency/stability in the squad suffered.

Rafa had to wheel and deal, and often operate in the bargain basement end of the market.  Kenny has the pick of pretty much who he wants across Europe and the world.  Just imagine what talent Rafa could have found, for 112 million quid, across Europe in 2011.  He would have found players of technical excellence.



In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Juan

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Re: Season 2011 - 2012
« Reply #674 on: January 03, 2012, 11:41:23 PM »
I am glad it pleases you not all of my arguments are rock solid. Unfortunately my overall analysis is and it'll prove in time how utterly naive you were to think this was just a "transitional phase". No CL footy on this side of 2015 I tell you. For that to happen we need a manager able to sign good enough players, pick his best formation and his best team. Our current manager failed all these three criteria and there's strong evidence to that fact.

Spare me the dramatics Martin, I take no pleasure in attempting to discount your opinions. I respect everyones opinion but I just find you are extremely negative and are willing to beat Kennys performace with any stick you can find. You downplay any positive aspects at the club and you attempt to magnify any faults. We lost to Man City tonight at the Eastlands. As bad as that is they do have a pretty good home record in 2011 and the fact that they beat United so comprehensively at OT suggests we werent just playing any old mugs.

In relation to the transitional phase if you hadnt noticed the club had been in pretty bad financial shape right up until October 2010. According to Ian Ayre we were a week from going into administration. We hadnt qualified for the Champions League in the previous season. So why should we have requalified for the Champions League within a year of the new owners being in place. Who ever said that it was going to be that straighforward. Maybe it will take us until after 2015. Is it your belief that the fact KDs spent 112 million means we should be in the top 4 now? Man City have proved that even with huge investment it can take a number of years to do and theyve spent alot more than us.