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Author Topic: Summer Transfer Window  (Read 122628 times)

Offline Juan

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #30 on: March 11, 2012, 02:21:24 PM »
Whether its Kenny in charge of the summer transfer budget, another manger or whether Comolli is doing the buying its about time we start buying players that are better than we've already got.

Ive defended Henderson, Downing, Carroll and even Adam at different points of the season but there are arguments to suggest all 4 players havent made the jump necessary to make it at a top club. Id still argue Henderson is a work in progress and one for the future but hes not justifying that 16 million price tag yet.

So when it comes to the summer window and every other window after I think we have to invest in proven talent. Even if its a case of spending our transfer budget on 1 or two top quality players each window and it taking 8 transfer windows for us to build a competitive team Id sooner do so than continue to go about our transfer business the way we are. 

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #31 on: March 11, 2012, 11:31:13 PM »
Whether its Kenny in charge of the summer transfer budget, another manger or whether Comolli is doing the buying its about time we start buying players that are better than we've already got.

Ive defended Henderson, Downing, Carroll and even Adam at different points of the season but there are arguments to suggest all 4 players havent made the jump necessary to make it at a top club. Id still argue Henderson is a work in progress and one for the future but hes not justifying that 16 million price tag yet.

So when it comes to the summer window and every other window after I think we have to invest in proven talent. Even if its a case of spending our transfer budget on 1 or two top quality players each window and it taking 8 transfer windows for us to build a competitive team Id sooner do so than continue to go about our transfer business the way we are.

Juan, you make two excellent and common sense points. Buy better than you already have and it's much better to only buy two players that have an improving effect on the team than four that don't.

There's so much wrong about our transfers in the last two active windows, that it's worrying that if the errors weren't seen before they were made then, how can we be confident the same won't happen again.

Some fans say 'Kenny will put it right' but why should he have to. If he'd have got it right previously there'd be no need to, and as he didn't get it then how can they be confident he'll get it right this Summer.
Commolli has said that the manager has the final say so we can only suppose that he was quite happy for the proposed targets to become actual signings. If he had the power of veto and didn't use it then the blame has to be laid at his feet. I also imagine he could have vetoed the proposed prices to be paid. Afterall, it would have left him potentially less out of any form of transfer budget there was.   
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Offline Juan

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #32 on: March 12, 2012, 12:28:33 AM »
Juan, you make two excellent and common sense points. Buy better than you already have and it's much better to only buy two players that have an improving effect on the team than four that don't.

There's so much wrong about our transfers in the last two active windows, that it's worrying that if the errors weren't seen before they were made then, how can we be confident the same won't happen again.

Some fans say 'Kenny will put it right' but why should he have to. If he'd have got it right previously there'd be no need to, and as he didn't get it then how can they be confident he'll get it right this Summer.
Commolli has said that the manager has the final say so we can only suppose that he was quite happy for the proposed targets to become actual signings. If he had the power of veto and didn't use it then the blame has to be laid at his feet. I also imagine he could have vetoed the proposed prices to be paid. Afterall, it would have left him potentially less out of any form of transfer budget there was.

Its disappointing that players arent working out. Adam at 6 million isnt such a bad buy but Downing and Carroll really need to look themselves in the mirror because they really have let this team down.

Yeah questions need to be asked about who has control over transfers and what has gone wrong. Being able to sign good free transfers like Bellamy is one thing but its imperative whoever has control over transfers has the ability to spend big money wisely. Thats not been done up to now so Henry Comolli and Kenny need to sit down and trash out why.

To be honest I was a little relieved not to see any panic buys in January but after Carroll last january I suspected we wouldnt sign anyone.

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #33 on: March 12, 2012, 01:22:15 PM »
Its disappointing that players arent working out. Adam at 6 million isnt such a bad buy but Downing and Carroll really need to look themselves in the mirror because they really have let this team down.

Yeah questions need to be asked about who has control over transfers and what has gone wrong. Being able to sign good free transfers like Bellamy is one thing but its imperative whoever has control over transfers has the ability to spend big money wisely. Thats not been done up to now so Henry Comolli and Kenny need to sit down and trash out why.

To be honest I was a little relieved not to see any panic buys in January but after Carroll last january I suspected we wouldnt sign anyone.

If we look at the purchases in terms of ability, performance and suitability, ignoring the fees, we need to ask just one question - have they been and are they exactly what we need. The fees only make the answer seem better or worse.

If we'd spent £3m-£5M on 'one for the future' in Henderson, then 'maybe' but only 'maybe' does it not seem as bad, but I would still say we were not in a position where we could afford (in terms of positions requiring filling) to be buying 'for the future'. Our immediate aim was to be building a team and squad to 'challenge' this season for a top four place. So the aim should have been players who can make an impact now and into the future, maybe in the age range of 23-27, but if a player such as Bellamy etc is available you also look at that as you need experience as well as relative youth. Balance is the key word.
Henderson wasn't really having a huge impact on the Sunderland team and even less on the England U-21s, unlike Jones who was having a bigger impact on the Blackburn team and at under 21 level. But such a huge chunk of the available funds seems to me to be not the best use of those funds.   
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Offline the dude abides

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #34 on: March 12, 2012, 04:33:18 PM »
Fergie's model is the one we should be following (the same model we used to use)

he always buys the players that we should be buying.

like Phil Jones is the one we should have been breaking the bank for last year (not friggen Andy Carroll).

and Fergie doesn't often go after a big name.  He prefers finding true quality - that will help him put his jigsaw together - e.g. vidic, carrick, hernandez, nani, etc.

And I note that in recent years, he has fallen in love with the Portuguese market. 

Whereas, our two Anfield Cowboys are lost unless they see the finished article, with primadonna ego and costing a fortune.....and long since past their sell-by-date. 

Our two best acquisitions last year were freebies, one was an easy talent to spot (Bellamy, who was near the end of his career); and the other I think our Director of Cowboys, found IIRC via a computer/database search.

Why we pay these two senior cowboys, I have no idea.  What they bring to the club, for their enormous salaries, I (again) am clueless.

Neither can they find any talent; nor use it (if they ever should find it).


In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #35 on: March 14, 2012, 12:35:44 AM »
Fergie's model is the one we should be following (the same model we used to use)

It's time we snatched our blueprint back from down the East Lancs Road.
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Offline the dude abides

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #36 on: March 14, 2012, 12:44:17 AM »
It's time we snatched our blueprint back from down the East Lancs Road.

very true.

BTW  It would not surprise me, if United snatched Rafa, either this summer or next.
In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #37 on: March 14, 2012, 08:24:06 PM »
very true.

BTW  It would not surprise me, if United snatched Rafa, either this summer or next.

Dude, don't!!!!  ;D
Don't make the same mistake twice, there's plenty of new ones to choose from.

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Offline the dude abides

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #38 on: March 14, 2012, 09:59:00 PM »
I see Bayern Munich's Gomez scored 4 last night.

No doubt he will now be on the radar screens of our two cowboys.


In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #39 on: March 14, 2012, 10:42:22 PM »
I see Bayern Munich's Gomez scored 4 last night.

No doubt he will now be on the radar screens of our two cowboys.

I think we missed the boat (again) on him a couple of seasons or so back.
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Offline barticus

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #40 on: March 16, 2012, 02:24:17 PM »
http://bleacherreport.com/tb/bfD0N?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=world-football

Cavani would be an excellent buy. We'd have to have the gift of the gab if he was to come to a team with no CL footie though...

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #41 on: March 17, 2012, 12:08:40 PM »
Cavani would be an excellent buy. We'd have to have the gift of the gab if he was to come to a team with no CL footie though...

He'd cost far too much and the salary we'd have to offer to compensate for a lack of CL would cripple us.

We need to find the 'next Cavani'. Our whole scouting department and the processess they employ are simply not working. Look at the quality and value the Geordies have unearthed. We are seriously hamstringing ourselves.
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Offline Juan

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #42 on: March 17, 2012, 01:53:20 PM »
He'd cost far too much and the salary we'd have to offer to compensate for a lack of CL would cripple us.

We need to find the 'next Cavani'. Our whole scouting department and the processess they employ are simply not working. Look at the quality and value the Geordies have unearthed. We are seriously hamstringing ourselves.

The problem is Tes although we cant probably afford to buy the likes of Cavani we probably cant afford not to buy top quality players like that either.

If we dont get into that top 4 in the next few seasons we risk permanently chasing the likes of Sunderland for 6th.

There are huge calls to make this summer. We have to be a success in the market. Personally I would try to get 20 million for Carroll and add that to our transfer budget. There would be the temptation to do the same with the likes of Downing and a few others too. Robbie Fowler suggested in the last week if Suarez isnt happy sell. They are probably the big calls that face the management. I would hate to see Suarez go and im not suggesting thats what we do but I do understand where Robbies coming from.

And if we still cant afford the likes of Llorente Cavani etc attempt to buy the Eriksens of this world whos quality is undoubted but whose transfer fee hasnt hit the crazy heights yet. Just like Silva, City paid 25 million for him but within another season or so you would have been adding 10 million to his price.

If our scouting department played football manager for 5 minutes they would probably know more about than the talent out there than they seem to do now.


Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #43 on: March 18, 2012, 01:19:13 AM »
The problem is Tes although we cant probably afford to buy the likes of Cavani we probably cant afford not to buy top quality players like that either.

If we dont get into that top 4 in the next few seasons we risk permanently chasing the likes of Sunderland for 6th.

There are huge calls to make this summer. We have to be a success in the market. Personally I would try to get 20 million for Carroll and add that to our transfer budget. There would be the temptation to do the same with the likes of Downing and a few others too. Robbie Fowler suggested in the last week if Suarez isnt happy sell. They are probably the big calls that face the management. I would hate to see Suarez go and im not suggesting thats what we do but I do understand where Robbies coming from.

And if we still cant afford the likes of Llorente Cavani etc attempt to buy the Eriksens of this world whos quality is undoubted but whose transfer fee hasnt hit the crazy heights yet. Just like Silva, City paid 25 million for him but within another season or so you would have been adding 10 million to his price.

If our scouting department played football manager for 5 minutes they would probably know more about than the talent out there than they seem to do now.

All that you say is so depressingly true, Juan. Carroll really is the cuckoo in the nest. We need to be scouting the German, Belgian, Dutch and even Danish leagues as there seems to be a wealth of technically excellent players coming from and playing in those leagues and we need to get in there before they become too big a talent for us to afford. Some low cost risk as opposed to obvious but average supposedly established players would be much smarter and players from these countries seem to have the mentality needed to deal with playing to the level and at the level we need them to. Let's see if Comolli can prove it was a mistake for Spurs, Arsenal and St Etienne to allow him to leave, and that their loss proves to be our gain.

It feels like we're always trying to undo past mistakes before we can think about taking a forward step. This Summer's business needs to yield a very high success rate otherwise top six will become the new 'title challenge' and when the Standard Chartered deal ends we'll be back to being earning peanuts from our main sponsor.
Don't make the same mistake twice, there's plenty of new ones to choose from.

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Offline Juan

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Re: Summer Transfer Window
« Reply #44 on: March 18, 2012, 03:03:41 PM »
It feels like we're always trying to undo past mistakes before we can think about taking a forward step. This Summer's business needs to yield a very high success rate otherwise top six will become the new 'title challenge' and when the Standard Chartered deal ends we'll be back to being earning peanuts from our main sponsor.

I wonder if Standard Chartered had their time back would they offer us such a huge deal. Does our support in the Far East mean we dont necessarily need to be challenging for the partnership to be a success. In fairness to Ayre some of the sponsorship deals he has pulled off on the business side of things are the footballing equivalent  as if the club had signed Messi.