Season 2012-2013

[Ageing Stick Insect]

I couldn't help but feel disgusted at the finishing (just embarassing!).

Football isn't an exact science. People have errors of judgement and make mistakes. On another day they go in. I don't see what there is to be embarassed about.

I agree with Dude that the style of football is poncy.

This attitude, oh look Suso played a lovely ball there gets us nowhere.
Its 90 mins..

Each to their own opinion. Easy on the eye might be another way of looking at it.

I think that there needs to be much more balance in the team, it all went down
the left yesterday, I can't understand why the more direct Downer didn't feature
on the right. It's too chaotic in the second half of the pitch with Luis popping up
everywhere and Stevie compounding matters by playing impossible balls all the time.
Courage, imo, would be to get a grip on the midfield and pull Stevie out of it, leave
it to the likes of Allen, Henderson and Sahin to Control that area. Fine in the final third
things can be more fluid but more structure is required elsewhere.

BR is too intoxicated by technicians Luis, Sterling, Suso, Shelvey & Gerrard at the expense
of intelligent players like e.g. Kuyt who do the dirty and effective work.

I can't form an opinion from 3 minutes of highlights on MoTD. If that's how you saw it, fair enough. If we get a result I'm not that bothered how poncy or not the football was. Strange way of describing a style of football. Seems our manager cannot do right for wrong.

[the dude abides]

Football isn't an exact science.

actually, it is an exact science.......one endeavours to score more goals than the opposition, and specific points awarded accordingly.

Each to their own opinion. Easy on the eye might be another way of looking at it.

I can't form an opinion from 3 minutes of highlights on MoTD. If that's how you saw it, fair enough. If we get a result I'm not that bothered how poncy or not the football was. Strange way of describing a style of football. Seems our manager cannot do right for wrong.

what a bizarre stance, after our worst ever start to a season,

Ray, you appear to spend your time getting in a tantrum at other folks posts, and then going on long sabbaticals.

why not actually watch our games and chat about them.

that is what a forum is all about.

[Ageing Stick Insect]

actually, it is an exact science.......one endeavours to score more goals than the opposition, and specific points awarded accordingly.

How you play cannot be an exact science as everyone has different styles. The desired result is the exact science. All teams desire the same thing but how they go about it differs.

what a bizarre stance, after our worst ever start to a season,

Then why isn't the UK press lambasting the team and manager because they're not. They can see that good football is being played but the results haven't gone our way due to a couple of basic mistakes. If we were playing crap football do you really think they would hold back?

Ray, you appear to spend your time getting in a tantrum at other folks posts, and then going on long sabbaticals.

why not actually watch our games and chat about them.

that is what a forum is all about.

Because sometimes I get so annoyed at what some write I don't want to join in. Also, I don't have as much free time as others because I still work and also have other interests.

And as for watching the team, I watch through legitimate broadcasts. I'm not interested in watching illegal feeds on a laptop. So the number of games I see is limited.

Off to bed now.

[Ed]

Football isn't an exact science. People have errors of judgement and make mistakes. On another day they go in. I don't see what there is to be embarassed about.

Given our tradition of producing top finishers it's embarassing.
This has been an ongoing problem at the club recently and it
should be taken seriously.

Each to their own opinion. Easy on the eye might be another way of looking at it.

Yeah but then it becomes purely a question of aesthetics and while I have no
problem with moments of individual genius that produce a tangible end product,
in general the beauty of football, imo, is the mechanics and dynamic of the team.
& before I hear it we are not in the same footballing solar system as Brazil '82 &
the total football experiment of the Dutch circa '74.

Strange way of describing a style of football.

It's more an attitude, I prefer teams that have mental steel, get results and i suppose as was
once said of Daley Thompson "It's not enough for him to win; he has to mentally destroy
his opponent". By comparison we run around all afternoon with very little end product and
have to suffer the indignity of a last 15 minutes of pressure from one of the weakest teams in
the division on our home patch. It's poncy 

Seems our manager cannot do right for wrong.

He did ok in the post match interview, mentioned clean sheets twice, seemed more results oriented
and wasn't off on his usual little self serving diversions. Though taking credit for Sterling's goal with
his we practise these things in training was less impressive (he couldn't help himself). One of these
days he may do a proper one where i can go "sounds like the LFC gaffer now, Thank Christ!" 

[the dude abides]

Then why isn't the UK press lambasting the team and manager because they're not. They can see that good football is being played but the results haven't gone our way due to a couple of basic mistakes. If we were playing crap football do you really think they would hold back?

the press always are behind the times (there is a significant time lag).....for a couple of reasons 1) there are very few really good football journalists (most are rubbish); and 2) they build you up, so that they can later shoot you down.   People like Martin Samuel, for example, are a joke. 

but the press always have their own agendas.  And they exist primarily to make profits.

And as for watching the team, I watch through legitimate broadcasts. I'm not interested in watching illegal feeds on a laptop. So the number of games I see is limited.

 

that being the case, you are mixing with some devilish folks in here.

some day, you may come over to the dark side.

there is a world beyond the BBC and Sky.

[Martinmarx]

aye, he may be a red...but what shade of red?

a chinese or a russian red.....a united or a scouse red.

double agents come in all shapes and guises.

 

Brilliant, that one! Cheers for the larf.

[Martinmarx]

I don't Tes. Probably why your humour was lost on me. 


At least Rodgers appears to understand Liverpool...His ideas can be a touch idealistic but that comes with youth and inexperience. He'll learn to find the balance.
Agreed. I think he will grow into the job quite rapidly though. He's definitely a thinker.
I haven't seen enough from MoTD highlights to judge Wisdom. I'm guessing you are watching games not available to UK viewers.

If you're asking me, Wisdom's already first-choice RB. What a talent that lad is!!! Fair enough his youth will let him down every now and then but it's obvious he has the mental strength to learn from his mistakes and improve. Suso, I think has a tendency to start the games well but fade out as the game progress.

[Martinmarx]

what a bizarre stance, after our worst ever start to a season.

That's all you have isn't it? That quasi-argument, I mean. Not saying it'll happen but if we were to win our next 3 games we'd end up finding ourselves in the best november position since God knows when. It's not your negativity mate, it's the stupidness of drawing major conclusions on the back of a handful of games that make anything you say void of credibility and simply tedious.

For those of us who actually support and believe in the manger of this great club I have no doubt in my mind this will be a season to remember and for good reasons. If picking and pissin on every little detail you can come by make you cum well then I'm happy for you. Just wish you could keep it to yourself and instead of spouting your negativity around get over the bitterness that seem to stem from the fact your beloved Rafa ain't ever gonna manage this team again.

[barticus]

Last time i looked, this was a forum, where people of different views were able to show pleasure or displeasure at what's going on at a club that we all think about every day.
If we all sing from the same hymn sheet then this would mean a pretty dull and unthoughtful forum and we'd have to put up with loads of 'agreed, yes, can't argue with the above' etc.

The reason i read all these comments is that we are all allowed to have an opinion about the good ship jolly Rodgers. And unless the pro Rodgers camp have turned into Captain Bligh, where every discontented voice walks the plank, then we should all put up with it.

The point of an opinion is that in order to put that point across you have to back it up with things like stats etc...Blind optimism is all very well but can be also dangerous...'i see no iceberg' for example. I saw on football focus the other day that steve clarke spoke about this season being the one that he and kenny would concentrate on, i think that was way too optimistic and the previous season saw precious little of a change around. Personal attacks such as f**k off etc really don't add anything except lessen the sayers point of view.

Last time i looked this forum was open to everyone. I for one, enjoy the banter and difference of opinion. I don't pull a hissy fit and start swearing at the pro rodgers supporters because they don't think like me.
Stats like the worst start for 120 years are meaningful. Have we fallen so low to not let that affect us anymore?
The press not being on the backs of the manager is down to the honeymoon period. They did the same with Hodgson (judge me after 10 games - which they did) and Dalglish in his first full season. The press can change in a month. Also maybe one reason why they're not quite as critical is because we're not a threat any more.

Rodgers has made mistakes which we've discussed ad infinitum and some promise with the brave use of the kids etc...The use of the youngsters in Europe have been a very positive and enjoyable one so far. I've preferred to watch those games this season than some of our league ones.

We all want our team to go back to beating Reading 4/5 nil and so we have every right to argue that gerrard should be nowhere near our central midfield because it weakens us or that another player should be used in another position...

The whole point of us being critical or praising is that we have all watched enough football in the past decades to know what's good and bad. We played some good stuff under Evans, Houllier, Benitez and that end half season of Kennys. We remember the distant past where we won things for 20 years. All those games are part of us and when we see positive things or things amiss with the team in front of us we have every right to criticize or praise as we see fit.

[the dude abides]

That's all you have isn't it? That quasi-argument, I mean. Not saying it'll happen but if we were to win our next 3 games we'd end up finding ourselves in the best november position since God knows when. It's not your negativity mate, it's the stupidness of drawing major conclusions on the back of a handful of games that make anything you say void of credibility and simply tedious.

For those of us who actually support and believe in the manger of this great club I have no doubt in my mind this will be a season to remember and for good reasons. If picking and pissin on every little detail you can come by make you cum

Martin, you're the most negative poster in the forum.

Indeed, you're one of the most negative people that I have ever encountered.

when we were top 4 each season, ranked one in Europe, and dominating the Champions League, you were whining away (as per usual).

try and stick to analysing the football and where the club is at; and keep your nasty personal abuse of other posters to yourself.  As they say in football, play the ball, not the man. 

and try not to post while drunk.

[Tes]

Last time i looked, this was a forum, where people of different views were able to show pleasure or displeasure at what's going on at a club that we all think about every day.
If we all sing from the same hymn sheet then this would mean a pretty dull and unthoughtful forum and we'd have to put up with loads of 'agreed, yes, can't argue with the above' etc.

The reason i read all these comments is that we are all allowed to have an opinion about the good ship jolly Rodgers. And unless the pro Rodgers camp have turned into Captain Bligh, where every discontented voice walks the plank, then we should all put up with it.

The point of an opinion is that in order to put that point across you have to back it up with things like stats etc...Blind optimism is all very well but can be also dangerous...'i see no iceberg' for example. I saw on football focus the other day that steve clarke spoke about this season being the one that he and kenny would concentrate on, i think that was way too optimistic and the previous season saw precious little of a change around. Personal attacks such as f**k off etc really don't add anything except lessen the sayers point of view.

Last time i looked this forum was open to everyone. I for one, enjoy the banter and difference of opinion. I don't pull a hissy fit and start swearing at the pro rodgers supporters because they don't think like me.
Stats like the worst start for 120 years are meaningful. Have we fallen so low to not let that affect us anymore?
The press not being on the backs of the manager is down to the honeymoon period. They did the same with Hodgson (judge me after 10 games - which they did) and Dalglish in his first full season. The press can change in a month. Also maybe one reason why they're not quite as critical is because we're not a threat any more.

Rodgers has made mistakes which we've discussed ad infinitum and some promise with the brave use of the kids etc...The use of the youngsters in Europe have been a very positive and enjoyable one so far. I've preferred to watch those games this season than some of our league ones.

We all want our team to go back to beating Reading 4/5 nil and so we have every right to argue that gerrard should be nowhere near our central midfield because it weakens us or that another player should be used in another position...

The whole point of us being critical or praising is that we have all watched enough football in the past decades to know what's good and bad. We played some good stuff under Evans, Houllier, Benitez and that end half season of Kennys. We remember the distant past where we won things for 20 years. All those games are part of us and when we see positive things or things amiss with the team in front of us we have every right to criticize or praise as we see fit.

Great post Dad Barticus.

I love reading the different opinions, views and thought processes behind them. I'll answer some and others, whilst I enjoy reading a different view, I may not agree with the view or the logic behind it, so I ignore it.

Some of us like to focus just on the football, some of us look at all aspects of the club, some of us look at the financial side as much as the football (probably due to the fact that in modern football money plays such a ridiculously large part in it).

We all come from different backgrounds and have had differing life experiences making us all who we are. We should expect a range of views and opinions.

I don't know if any of you post or read other forums such as RAWK or TLW, but on RAWK there is a decreed view you have to subscribe to (or you're likely to be banned) and TLW gets very abusive, both on a personal level and at players and managers, and ends up very polar with each end of the spectrum 'laying into' the other.

Let's not go down either route on here. Let's be big enough people to respect every opinion offered, even if we vehemently disagree or think they are overly negative. That reaction in itself is only an opinion of an opinion.

Bottom line - we all want success for the club. I really don't think anyone is petty enough to positively want any aspect of failure just so they can be 'proved right'.

[Martinmarx]

Last time i looked, this was a forum, where people of different views were able to show pleasure or displeasure at what's going on at a club that we all think about every day.
If we all sing from the same hymn sheet then this would mean a pretty dull and unthoughtful forum and we'd have to put up with loads of 'agreed, yes, can't argue with the above' etc.

The reason i read all these comments is that we are all allowed to have an opinion about the good ship jolly Rodgers. And unless the pro Rodgers camp have turned into Captain Bligh, where every discontented voice walks the plank, then we should all put up with it.

The point of an opinion is that in order to put that point across you have to back it up with things like stats etc...Blind optimism is all very well but can be also dangerous...'i see no iceberg' for example. I saw on football focus the other day that steve clarke spoke about this season being the one that he and kenny would concentrate on, i think that was way too optimistic and the previous season saw precious little of a change around. Personal attacks such as f**k off etc really don't add anything except lessen the sayers point of view.

Last time i looked this forum was open to everyone. I for one, enjoy the banter and difference of opinion. I don't pull a hissy fit and start swearing at the pro rodgers supporters because they don't think like me.
Stats like the worst start for 120 years are meaningful. Have we fallen so low to not let that affect us anymore?
The press not being on the backs of the manager is down to the honeymoon period. They did the same with Hodgson (judge me after 10 games - which they did) and Dalglish in his first full season. The press can change in a month. Also maybe one reason why they're not quite as critical is because we're not a threat any more.

Rodgers has made mistakes which we've discussed ad infinitum and some promise with the brave use of the kids etc...The use of the youngsters in Europe have been a very positive and enjoyable one so far. I've preferred to watch those games this season than some of our league ones.

We all want our team to go back to beating Reading 4/5 nil and so we have every right to argue that gerrard should be nowhere near our central midfield because it weakens us or that another player should be used in another position...

The whole point of us being critical or praising is that we have all watched enough football in the past decades to know what's good and bad. We played some good stuff under Evans, Houllier, Benitez and that end half season of Kennys. We remember the distant past where we won things for 20 years. All those games are part of us and when we see positive things or things amiss with the team in front of us we have every right to criticize or praise as we see fit.

Well ain't that sweet? Problem is that your fine words doesn't hold stretch.  If we beat Reading 1-0 it's "oh, look at what a farce we've become only beating them by 1 at home", or, conversly, if we put 3, 4 or even 5 past them it's "ah, that's a one off against a newly promoted side at home". Damn if you do, damn if you don't. You can't argue with people like that as they're fundamentally indifferent to a serious and mature discussion.

You say that "stat" saying this is our worst start to a season in 2394 years is an important one. How is it an important stat? Please explain it to me because I don't understand it. First of all the number of games it's based on is ridiculously low.

Because the number of games played are so few it's, secondly, hard to say anything thoughtful or credible on the base of that "stat". As I said in my previous post, less than a handful of wins from now would put us in a better position then we ever were under Rafa in November. I remember one season where we had our bestest start in 2394 years only to go without a win for, was it, 14 games (tho admittedly that was under GH but it says a lot about how little this "stat" really means in terms of how you'll fare over the course of a season).

It's pretty much as Edward insisted in a post above: from day 1 the Rafaites have spouted their bitterness at him for no other reason than Brendan Rodgers not being Rafa. Rafael Benitez got 6 full seasons to implement his ideas. He failed. What's the problem? Moving on. Simple as.

I think it's pathetic to write off, criticize, ridicule and forecast our manager and how he will fare before he even got 1 season behind him, let alone a handful of games. But according to you, it is us "pro-Rodgers" (I'd prefer pro-LFC-manager-whoever-he-is, but each to his own) who has caused this forum to be less pleasant in the last couple of monhts. Spot on analysis there, matey!

I for one, look forward to and enjoy watching us play for the first time in 2 decades. But how can it be an enjoyable experience to watch LFC play when the team isn't balanced to fork our another p**s-boring draw at home to PL giants such as West Ham, Fulham, Hull etc.

Just so happy to never have to watch this crap again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t00D23R63ig

[Tes]

Martin, I'm not sure whether you're meaning it that way, but why the pop at Barticus?

He didn't bring up the stat to which you refer, in fact reading back over his reply, it was very balanced, in fact a positive one and willing the team to succeed.

As far as the stat goes, it is a fact, in the same way as having a 100% record so far would also be a fact. Neither would guarantee anything come May. Some of us are more worried about it, some of us don't take it too seriously yet.
It could be a pointer towards something or equally prove to be a red herring.

I wouldn't label those who appreciate what Benitez did (CL success, No1 team in Europe, regular top 4 finish) as fawning sycophants any more than I'd label those who had got fed up with certain aspects of his management (the rigid subs, the distrust of individual flair, the appearance of buying for the sake of it, the overt politiking etc) as raving heretics.

Both Rafa before and Brendan now are working under financial restraints at a time when other clubs have endless cash. Others have had more stability off pitch, again something that applies to both managers.

FFP may or may not either lock us out of the top four without a billionaire benefactor or allow us a route back into the top four and beyond.

Whoever was manager now has a tough job living with and slowly trying to rectify the damage done by the Toxics and Purslow and the errors, inexperience, and lack of knowledge of FSG.   

[Ed]

Martin, I'm not sure whether you're meaning it that way, but why the pop at Barticus?

Yeah, out of order Marxman!

[Martinmarx]

Maybe that was a tad uncalled for. My apologies Bart. Anyroad, and as you say tes, a fact's a fact. What matters is, to me, in what context you put it in use. If you use it just to belittle the manager and the team it's quite provocative, at least where I come from as it doesn't help promote sensible discussion, isn't supportive of the club and doesn't help to keep a mature atmosphere on here.

Again Bart, sorry if you took offense.