Season 2012-2013

[Ed]

Sterling needs to be rested..he's knackered...
Gerrard needs to be rested..he's knackered.

Ayre needs to be rested he's knackered...put the big red chicken in charge 

mindful of what that treacherous little rat Owen said about

Don't recall an Owen playing for us...was he the fella who scored all them Owen goals?
Sounds like a c**t mind 

Today was like those soldiers in the trenches of WW1 going over the top:

"Hey look it's fourth!"

before being machine gunned into oblivion.

[Tes]

Villa - 1 win in their last 16 away wins. Yet another team to join the list of others over the last few (or more) years to end dire runs of some sort against us. I now dread it when we play a team that are on some sort of bad, negative run, or individual players come to that.

Still, it's killed any lingering expectations Rodgers may have whipped up with his ambitions to finish 2nd, so it's back to reality, which isn't a bad thing, as we didn't want the owners to think they had a sniff of a reason to misplace their chequebook.

[the dude abides]

Doubt Brendan will be. 

 

[the dude abides]

Villa - 1 win in their last 16 away wins. Yet another team to join the list of others over the last few (or more) years to end dire runs of some sort against us. I now dread it when we play a team that are on some sort of bad, negative run, or individual players come to that.

Still, it's killed any lingering expectations Rodgers may have whipped up with his ambitions to finish 2nd, so it's back to reality, which isn't a bad thing, as we didn't want the owners to think they had a sniff of a reason to misplace their chequebook.

it's something like two years since we last won three games on the trot.

I think Rodgers is even worse than Dalglish.

but today was the beginning of the end.  He will not survive many more such results at Anfield.

the bloke has no tactics, beyond "get stuck in, early doors"

he's been badly found (as have our fuk.wit owners)

I worry that he will be given another window (i.e. January) to waste a pile more cash on expensive rubbish mid-table players.

he must scour the divisions across england, for expensive midfielders and attackers who cannot score goals.

he has a niche market.  He has it all to himself.

[Ed]

Just watched the game...

The third goal!!

Just threw my hands up in the air and thought ffs.

I'd have expected the post match to have been
one sentence

That's just simply not good enough!

As for Villa, the irony of it, a masterclass of hard work
and ruthless simplicity with a coach in a tracksuit on
the sideline whilst ours has a rolex the size of a house
on his wrist.

I'm sure the red nets inspired them! As for fortress Anfield,
Jesus wept...

Its the little things (and Gerrard for most of the 2nd half) that
were missing. Nothing far as I can see wrong with the buildup
play first 30 mins. But then you ask the questions in those little
breaks when Villa had the ball (the small little battles early in
possession), the simple questions

"why isn't that player fighting for his life for the shirt, getting stuck
in and doing the dirty work?"

because they still don't do the basics of hard work. Sterling off his
game walking around in the first half, Shelvey playing an unfamiliar role.
Villa weather the storm, not in the least knocked out of their stride
and it was fractions with the first goal, a fraction too much time and
space and the tiniest of fractions to the right of the keeper. The 2nd
goal follows 'cos there's not enough desire to get back and make
sure its defended

Lessons learned? The 3rd goal just so shocking 

The little things, getting stuck in, making the opposition uncomfortable
early in possession. The things you NEVER had to ask Dirk Kuyt to do.

the bloke has no tactics, beyond "get stuck in, early doors"

If only they got stuck in, it's not there imo, did Villa ever look
ruffled the entire game. Sure I think Suarez dispossessed a Villa
defender in the first half, but the game is 90 mins.

[Ed]

11   West Ham United   16   22
12   Liverpool   17   22
13   Fulham   17   20

The West Ham Fulham sandwich 

[the dude abides]

here are my thoughts..

Sterling needs to be rested..he's knackered..

Gerrard needs to be rested..he's knackered...he's 32..

Reina needs to be reminded that he isn't as good as he thinks he is...play Brad Jones...if Wenger offers 10-15 mil for him then grab it..

Downing should never play as left back ever again...as soon as i saw the team sheet, i was unnerved...let alone the other defenders around him...

things to do:
lucas is back, so play Sahin and Allen in positions they are comfortable with
Gerrard when rested should play behind Suarez.
If you have to play Downing at least play him in his favoured left wing position..thus giving sterling a break...
Shelvey and Suso need to play more...

If you don't start resting the players and knowing FSG we ain't gonna be bringing anyone decent in for January, let alone class like Huntelaar...then come mid feb it isn't going to be pretty...

i agree with giving sterling a rest.  Hope he signs his new contract.  He is the one bright light that has shone this season.

gerrard has played in all our league games, IIRC.  The kyrptonite is all but used up.  Super-human powers are gone.

reina is a class keeper.  Any keeper will suffer with a dodgy defence and boss. 

agree re downing......until he leaves, show he feature, at least play him in his proper position.  Rodgers looked a real fool yesterday, playing downing as a fullback. 

lucas is essential to our cause. 

Allen is a nothing midfielder.  He cannot defend and he cannot score.  He's very much a Rodger's type player - a possession man.  I'd sell him in the summer.  I suspect Borini is not up to much either.  Henderson also needs t obe shipped out.

Sahin and Suso, too inexperienced to offer consistency this season.

ok, let me outline my scenario for the rest of the season.

this season is toast.....it's been dire.

that in mind, our first objective is to secure our premiership status ASAP.  Let's get 40 points as quick as we can.  The nightmare scenario is the club losing all confidence after a bad defeat (like getting hammered at anfield by villa), and going on a losing run.....with an inexperienced manager unable to turn things around.

so 40 points is our first goal.

the next goal is to finish no lower than 8th.  From memory, 8th was our lowest ever finish, in my lifetime.  If we can finish 8th, we;ll have wrestled something from this season of dung.

I imagine we will finish in or around 50 points - plus or minus 3.

yesterday was the beginning of the end for rodgers.  The scary thing is, Villa could have scored more goals. 

Rodgers needs to be  dismissed in May; and a top manager brought in.....i.e. someone of experience, who has been successful.

There are only 5 or 6 players that I would retain.  Outside Suarez, I do not believe that we have bought one top player these past 3 seasons.  I'd ship the vast majority of these past 3 season's acquisitions, out.

Of course with all this recommended change, comes the need for major money to be invested. 

Our yankee owners would have saved a helluva amount of money, if they had spent the money on bringing in a top chief executive and a top manager, in the first place.  They thought they were saving money.  but it has ended up costing them a helluva lot more money in the long run.

[Martinmarx]

Disappointing result. We never showed up after they scored. Suarez misplacing that pass to Gerrard for 1-0 probably was the defining moment which goes a long way to show how vulnerable we really are.

Gutted.

[the dude abides]

David Brent said on Sunday: "It is a strange thing football. We were talked up all week about us being top-four material but we know within the group we still have a long way to go."

typical of Rodgers, he cannot hold an honest discussion.

in the above, he deceitfully claims that others were talking the club up, all week, as being top 4 material.

NO, NO, NO.   Nobody I know, or heard off was talking the club up all week.    I detected two people who were blabbering.  Captain Marvel said in midweek, that the club could now push on and look to finish top 4.  And on Friday, on the eve of the Villa game, Rodgers claimed that we needed to be looking to finish higher than merely 4th.  Rodgers was looking for second spot.

And now, after his nutty boasts were followed up by a cringeworthy Anfield hammering by Villa, he dishonestly blames others for these top four expectations. 

Brendan Rodgers needs to show some honesty.  His endless verbal diarea, and deceit, will be the end of him at Anfield.

[Ed]

OMFG Tomkins beginning to hedge his bets?

http://tomkinstimes.com/2012/12/what-is-brendan-rodgers/

Actually readable (just) for once, given he's decided to
dispense with the rose-tinted glasses (kindof).

What's particularly galling about the Villa result, imo, is they're
a virtual mirror image (but vastly cheaper) version of us in terms
of being in transition, very young side etc.  but brushed us aside
at home?? Don't forget they were bringing on fringe players toward
the end before we got our goal. 

[Tes]

typical of Rodgers, he cannot hold an honest discussion.

in the above, he deceitfully claims that others were talking the club up, all week, as being top 4 material.

NO, NO, NO.   Nobody I know, or heard off was talking the club up all week.    I detected two people who were blabbering.  Captain Marvel said in midweek, that the club could now push on and look to finish top 4.  And on Friday, on the eve of the Villa game, Rodgers claimed that we needed to be looking to finish higher than merely 4th.  Rodgers was looking for second spot.

And now, after his nutty boasts were followed up by a cringeworthy Anfield hammering by Villa, he dishonestly blames others for these top four expectations. 

Brendan Rodgers needs to show some honesty.  His endless verbal diarea, and deceit, will be the end of him at Anfield.

When I read that comment, I thought exactly the same as you, Dude. Who was talking us up? Had I missed it? No-one from outside the club. Saying we had the potential to finish second are not the words of man who still thinks his team 'has a long way to go'.
And then he calls us 'complacent'. I didn't see a complacent performance, rather a system that has failed again, with the same end result, goals scored far too easily by the opposition.
We have an unbeaten run, though not much winning in it, then a couple of victories, yet despite being in the bottom half of the table most of the season, and just getting into the top half last weekend, we've suddenly proved ourselves to be better than the table states.
It seems a couple of people have got carried away with 'not losing' and that 'success' seems to have gone to Rodgers' head. 'Justified. See my philosophy does work'.

If yesterday's carving up was an isolated incident then maybe, just maybe, the 'bad day at the office' analogy may have had a semblance of truth about it, but teams have been able to do it far too regularly this season. It seems to be one of the gaping holes in the gameplan. When a team like Villa, 1 away win in the last 16, can stroll through us with such ease then we really do have problems.

If FSG do decide to get rid then any transfer budget will get spent on paying off Rodgers and his staff, and probably more spent on compensation for the next one too.
But who trusts them to get the next appointment right? We've already lost too much money on poor appointments and their horrendous buys.

I just don't see how the long term solution involves FSG, unless there are some truly massive changes made, but I simply don't see any signs of that happening or that the owners even see a need.

[the dude abides]

I just don't see how the long term solution involves FSG, unless there are some truly massive changes made, but I simply don't see any signs of that happening or that the owners even see a need.

agreed with all you say, Tes.

I highlighted the above comment, in order to ask if you now have finally have had enough of FSG? 

I made my mind up during the summer.  I realised that 1) they knew fek all about the game; 2) refused to appoint people who would know (I assume they wanted cheaper people instead, like ayres and rodgers); and 3) whether on purpose, or by accident, the club was being downgraded.

FSG's time is up.   And Rodgers should go with them.

[Tes]

agreed with all you say, Tes.

I highlighted the above comment, in order to ask if you now have finally have had enough of FSG? 

I made my mind up during the summer.  I realised that 1) they knew fek all about the game; 2) refused to appoint people who would know (I assume they wanted cheaper people instead, like ayres and rodgers); and 3) whether on purpose, or by accident, the club was being downgraded.

FSG's time is up.   And Rodgers should go with them.

It's starting to get that way, Dude. I've wanted to give them time and space to do the things required to make up for their lack of knowledge and understanding of all aspects of what they bought into.
I don't blame them for a lack of knowledge, but do blame them for not taking the right steps to make sure that their knowledge void was an irrelevance.
How many blunders does Ayre have to preside over before enough is enough?
A chairman lacking in knowledge and experience is not a problem if the rest of the board have the expertise, and he really only has to act as a figure head.

Where is 'the old head' that Rodgers can turn to, or sound out, or be taken to one side by and 'have a few things explained to him'. He may be learning, but who's he learning from?

[the dude abides]

A chairman lacking in knowledge and experience is not a problem if the rest of the board have the expertise, and he really only has to act as a figure head.

Where is 'the old head' that Rodgers can turn to, or sound out, or be taken to one side by and 'have a few things explained to him'. He may be learning, but who's he learning from?

ah but Rodgers IS the 'old head'.........I see him talking at times, as if he has been working in the game for 40 years......and is a sage, with loads of experience and titles behind him.   When in reality, the kid is only 39 years old, and has been in the game ten minutes.  Gerrard and Carragher are not much younger than him.

BR is a bul.l.shi.tter, was a bul.l.shi.tter, and will always be a bul.l.shi.tter.  I have met too many of his type in my lifetime.

[Tes]

ah but Rodgers IS the 'old head'.........I see him talking at times, as if he has been working in the game for 40 years......and is a sage, with loads of experience and titles behind him.   When in reality, the kid is only 39 years old, and has been in the game ten minutes.  Gerrard and Carragher are not much younger than him.

BR is a bul.l.shi.tter, was a bul.l.shi.tter, and will always be a bul.l.shi.tter.  I have met too many of his type in my lifetime.

Dude, our problem (that's you and I) is we don't 'get' the modern ways of doing. If it sounds right or looks right, ergo, it is right. We want too much. A bit of substance to back up the image. A proven record to back up the 'talk' or at least point towards there being substantive potential for success. We value experience over theory of "I'd know what to do in that situation, I think, or I'll probably be able to figure out what to do".
We still like a paper hardcopy, just in case.

My problem with contemplating the manager's position, is not the contemplation in itself or the thought of getting rid of a manager after half a season, but that there's no sensible basis for thinking it would make any difference, purely and entirely because who is there at the club to make the decision about who the replacement would be?
Ian Ayre? Henry? Werner? It's like giving a chippy an orthopaedic saw and expecting him to do an amputation and bringing in a 70 year old retired seamstress to do the stitching up and dealing with the wound.

Until we appoint a CEO/MD fit for purpose or appoint a couple of 'football people' to the board we are likely to be back again doing the same thing in 12 months time.
Even appoint a football director, not a DoF, but a director to the board to deal with these sort of aspects.
Bayern, for example, have a football board who report direct to the club board, which is more 'the business board'. They run all football aspects and the board simply ratify their work from a financial standpoint. They work side by side, providing strength to the required areas of a football based business.