August 22, 2019, 08:19:33 AM

Author Topic: The Anfield curse.  (Read 3261 times)

Offline Edward224

  • Established
  • ****
  • Posts: 977
    • View Profile
The Anfield curse.
« on: November 04, 2012, 08:02:04 PM »
We can't seem to win a game at Anfield. From last season to now our home record is that of a relegated team.

Why can't we seem get a win at Anfield.

For me it's something deeper than just ability of the players and performances. It is the whole psyche of playing at Anfield which is the problem for us.

For me it goes back to the Houllier era when we started to give shed teams too much respect and play more defensive. They seeped in the psyche of the players and under Rafa that didn't change. Especially against the shed teams. Under Kenny and now under Brendan it hasn't gotten better.

What can be done to make Anfield a fortress again.

Offline barticus

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1076
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2012, 10:51:22 PM »
hmmm....Liverpool went 30 matches undefeated from the end of October 2005 to March 2007...thats making a statement of a 'fortress anfield' surely??? and the manager of course is he who shall not be named...aka rafa...

can't bring the man who shall not be named though...cos he's akin to trotsky under the regime of stalin...

Offline Tes

  • Too old to be a
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 10196
  • I hate defending
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2012, 12:00:14 AM »
It's about belief. The reason the Mancs do so well is that the manager has instilled in the players and the fans that they will win the game.

We used to be the experts at the late goal because we believed we'd win and kept going for every second of the game until we did so. The crowd believed and the players fed off that. The players believed and the crowd fed off that.
Don't make the same mistake twice, there's plenty of new ones to choose from.

Those who choose to preach would do well to take note of their own sermons.

Offline Ed

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1830
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2012, 01:13:20 AM »
Fortress - A heavily protected and impenetrable building.

That was Shankly's idea.

It's difficult to create a fortress though, otherwise every team in the
division would have one! Anyway, it's not an overnight thing and
everyone needs to play their part, the manager, fans and team.

I suppose if everyone put as much effort into their performance (fans,
manager and team) as Luis Suarez, it might be a start.


 

Offline Martinmarx

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1822
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2012, 10:06:52 AM »
I would agree with Bart, during that period Anfield was well and truly a fortress. If I counted correctly, we went unbeaten 31 games, winning an astonishing 25. 2 years later tho, Rafa had been found out and many of those wins had been turned into draws. His inability to turn it back, eventually, became his downfall.

The question is though, whether this inability, this curse, to win at Anfield is a problem Brendan created or something he inherited? I would say the latter. I would also say the only way to sort it is on conjunction with Tes' argument. It's not a tactical change, hell, it may not even require new signings, it's all down to belief and a never-say-die attitude. Yesterday for example. We don't need to make a hypothetical argument on how the game would've panned out if RVN and Rushie in their prime would play alongside Luis. That's pointless and speculative. Fact of the matter is we created enough to win it from the chances we actually created.

The actual downside with the squad being this thin is that many of the young players know they'll get games meaning their career's will thereby most certainly be in the bank already. That makes them lose focus and effort while wearing the red shirt. Look at Shelvey for instance. 3rd game running where he seems to be on another planet. Just look at his waving with his arms when Suarez don't pass the ball to him in the first situation. He then turn his back and start walking towards our goal until he realise Luis got past his defender on the goalline, then he runs back but it's all too late. The required level of concentration is gone and so is the chance to score the winning goal for us in this massive massive game. Youth? I don't know. I don't think so. If you're good enough you're old enough. Shelvey in that situation alone displayed a lack of that vital and necessary hunger and understanding of the game that I truly think goes beyond the question of age if you are to become a great player. It's simply who he is - content with being picked. No matter how thin a squad, I don't think Fergie would ever let him come close the starting XI again as a way to send a clear signal what's asked of a United player, just like Nani won't be with United for much longer after his fukc up against Chelsea last week.

If anything, I'd ask Brendan to be a tad more ruthless.


« Last Edit: November 05, 2012, 10:10:57 AM by Martinmarx »
The modest Oracle of the Anfield Road Forum sometimes mistaken for Judas Iscariot.

Offline Ed

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1830
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2012, 04:10:54 PM »
Been thinking, maybe a consignment of
cranberry juice  ;D

Offline the dude abides

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 8113
  • that rug really tied the room together
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2012, 05:23:00 PM »
hmmm....Liverpool went 30 matches undefeated from the end of October 2005 to March 2007...thats making a statement of a 'fortress anfield' surely??? and the manager of course is he who shall not be named...aka rafa...

can't bring the man who shall not be named though...cos he's akin to trotsky under the regime of stalin...

yes, we once had a fortress, under the Man(ager) With No Name.

We once used to be Europe's number one ranked club; and win the occasional trophy; often beating Europe's finest along the way.

Edward and Marty have painted themselves into a really tight corner.
In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Martinmarx

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1822
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #7 on: November 05, 2012, 05:47:20 PM »
I would agree with Bart, during that period Anfield was well and truly a fortress. If I counted correctly, we went unbeaten 31 games, winning an astonishing 25. 2 years later tho, Rafa had been found out and many of those wins had been turned into draws. His inability to turn it back, eventually, became his downfall.

@ dude. You often seem to conveniently forget to tell the whole story, just selected parts. But then again, it doesn't seem as you're here to engage in mature discussions. It seems a pretty black and white world that place you live in.
The modest Oracle of the Anfield Road Forum sometimes mistaken for Judas Iscariot.

Offline the dude abides

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 8113
  • that rug really tied the room together
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #8 on: November 05, 2012, 06:12:48 PM »
@ dude. You often seem to conveniently forget to tell the whole story

yes, you are correct, I forgot to add:

it took Fergie 7 seasons before he took United to their first title (of modern times).
In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Edward224

  • Established
  • ****
  • Posts: 977
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #9 on: November 05, 2012, 10:50:46 PM »
yes, we once had a fortress, under the Man(ager) With No Name.

We once used to be Europe's number one ranked club; and win the occasional trophy; often beating Europe's finest along the way.

Edward and Marty have painted themselves into a really tight corner.

Shame that fortress didn't include home victories over Fulham, West Ham Stoke and Hull which would have won us the title in 2009. Even winning two of those home games would have given us the title. Yeah good fortress that.

Offline Martinmarx

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1822
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #10 on: November 05, 2012, 11:07:44 PM »
yes, you are correct, I forgot to add:

it took Fergie 7 seasons before he took United to their first title (of modern times).

You're not an easy fella to follow, dude. Are you trying to tell us we got rid of Rafa prematurely? That 6 full sesaons despite the fact our game steadily declined during the final 3 years, that he bought and sold 85 players, got rid of Parry, got sole control of transfer dealings wasn't enough time? TOr was it G & H's fault his fear of losing always beat his will to win which eventually transferred to the team and its increasingly static and predictable performances (tho you no doubt would call them perfectly balanced as when the genius Rafa replaced a fit and eager Torres for Ngog at 1-1 away at Brummies with 25 to go)?  I honestly do not understand what you're on to, to be perfectly honest.
The modest Oracle of the Anfield Road Forum sometimes mistaken for Judas Iscariot.

Offline Tes

  • Too old to be a
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 10196
  • I hate defending
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #11 on: November 05, 2012, 11:35:43 PM »
Youth? I don't know. I don't think so. If you're good enough you're old enough.

Martin, I think the 'good enough, old enough' saying tends to refer to technical ability. It's the one thing that most managers agree on is that young players will be inconsistant to start with, first couple of seasons or so.
What Shelvey did was down to age, or rather a lack of experience due to age. The older you get, the more experienced you become and you handle situations like that better. You know not to 'switch off', to keep focused, as the situation on the pitch can turn about in a second and you need to be focused and concentrate to take advantage when it happens. The mental side, which is wide-ranging, tends to develop later than the technical side, and is also dependant on a player's personality for the rate and level it will eventually achieve.
Don't make the same mistake twice, there's plenty of new ones to choose from.

Those who choose to preach would do well to take note of their own sermons.

Offline the dude abides

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 8113
  • that rug really tied the room together
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #12 on: November 05, 2012, 11:53:34 PM »
You're not an easy fella to follow, dude. Are you trying to tell us we got rid of Rafa prematurely? That 6 full sesaons despite the fact our game steadily declined during the final 3 years, that he bought and sold 85 players, got rid of Parry, got sole control of transfer dealings wasn't enough time? TOr was it G & H's fault his fear of losing always beat his will to win which eventually transferred to the team and its increasingly static and predictable performances (tho you no doubt would call them perfectly balanced as when the genius Rafa replaced a fit and eager Torres for Ngog at 1-1 away at Brummies with 25 to go)?  I honestly do not understand what you're on to, to be perfectly honest.

just because you hate the man, doesn;t take a single thing away from Rafa's superb record, Martin.

given how badly Rodgers has done to date at Anfield, you really ought to show a lot more contrition.

you are looking a right mug now, given you and edward's nasty personal abuse of others in here.

In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Martinmarx

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1822
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #13 on: November 06, 2012, 01:26:01 AM »
just because you hate the man, doesn;t take a single thing away from Rafa's superb record, Martin.

given how badly Rodgers has done to date at Anfield, you really ought to show a lot more contrition.

you are looking a right mug now, given you and edward's nasty personal abuse of others in here.

I don't hate the man. Stop that childish crap, will you? I just don't agree with you his record is that superb. I don't know how many times in this place I stated I was the happiest camper around when we signed him, that his Valencia played the best footy I've seen on this side of our heydays, that he did brilliantly during the first 30 months in charge. There we agree. Where we disagree is the development of the team and the way it played during his last 3 seasons in charge. I maintain our game took a turn for the worse. That we became dull, uninspiring, robotlike, static. The players didn't look like they enjoyed their footy. In short, watching us play arosed more negative than positive feelings. The results may not have gone our way during the extremly short time Brendan's been in charge but at least the butterflies and the nudging feeling something good is about to happen, are back and I, for one, appreciate just that very very much.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 01:30:47 AM by Martinmarx »
The modest Oracle of the Anfield Road Forum sometimes mistaken for Judas Iscariot.

Offline Tes

  • Too old to be a
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 10196
  • I hate defending
    • View Profile
Re: The Anfield curse.
« Reply #14 on: November 06, 2012, 08:50:15 PM »
Pako Ayestarán, the modern day Peter Taylor.
Don't make the same mistake twice, there's plenty of new ones to choose from.

Those who choose to preach would do well to take note of their own sermons.