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Author Topic: Summer Transfer Window 2014  (Read 83070 times)

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #270 on: July 28, 2014, 11:52:56 AM »
So post Remy, we're again being linked with Southampton's Jay Rodriguez. If we pulled out of the Remy deal on medical grounds, signing a player before seeing how they recover from an ACL injury would be crass stupidity.

ACL injuries are one of the worst a footballer can get and too many of them are never the same again after one.

We're being linked everywhere with him today, but as previously stated it would be a massive gamble buying a player for whom pace is a big part of his game, who has yet to recover from an anterior cruciate ligament injury and there's no way of telling if it will have a long term effect on his pace or playing style, and also what the psychological effects on him could be when he comes back. Additionally, other injuries could be easily picked up, especially in the first six months or so afterwards.

Although Lucas was never exactly blessed with pace he's never been the same player since since his acl injury, and his propensity for picking up injuries far more often than he did before his injury is probably not a coincidence. For a player who's come through what he has since joining the club, proving his mental toughness time and again, his problems since the acl injury have all been physical.
Would Rodriguez have that same level of mental strength?

On this one at least, the manager would be wise to heed his own words yesterday and look again next Summer if he still feels that Rodriguez has something to offer that we need.
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Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #271 on: July 28, 2014, 12:03:40 PM »
Bart, look at this way, once the merger with Southampton is complete we'll have Ronald Koeman rather than that Colin bloke as Rodgers' assistant. I'm not keen on the new badge which has the Liverbird stood beneath a tree, with it's foot on a ball and a halo (I think it's a halo but it could be a 'symbolic' wedding ring) above it's head. And the twig in it's mouth has been replaced by that white rose thing off Southampton's badge. The poor thing looks more like Ermintrude. It looks like Warrior must have designed it.




 ;D


http://www.footballfancast.com/premiership/liverpool/liverpool-announce-new-crest-plans-and-name-change

What about Southpool instead, then one of our nicknames 'pool wouldn't need the be changed.
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Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #272 on: July 28, 2014, 05:43:00 PM »
Harry's take on things:

Loic Remy is fine, there is no issue with his fitness so I don't understand why move to Liverpool collapsed, says Harry Redknapp

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2708430/Loic-Remy-fine-Liverpool-LYING-collapsed-says-Harry-Redknapp.html


Harry Redknapp baffled by reports of QPR’s Loïc Rémy failing medical

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jul/28/harry-redknapp-loic-remy-qpr-liverpool


What Harry's said is odd or rather the fact that he's being freely interviewed, as QPR were supposedly angry that the story had broken:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/loic-remy-transfer-qpr-fume-3923597

Apparently Ayre and QPR's Phil Beard have spoken and agreed not to reveal the reasons, which is why Rodgers played such a straight bat to the question - Harry it seems hasn't got the memo.

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11711/9398011/transfer-news-harry-redknapp-denies-loic-remy-failed-liverpool-medical - video, halfway down page.

Rodgers' reply to questions about the transfer: " It's very simple, we have decided not to go ahead with the deal.
It's unfortunate for the player - we're obviously disappointed - but there's nothing more to be said. We move onto other targets.
"

One sentence stands out though, according to Redknapp "He has never failed a medical before. He’s never had a problem and didn’t miss a game at Newcastle (where he spent last season on loan)."

Wrong on two points. He did fail his Marseille medical originally, and he missed games at Newcastle through injury, all of August with a calf injury, which apparently amounted to 11 games in total (including pre-season games, I guess) and then 5 games between the start of March and the start of April, and he was playing with an injury (knee, I think it was) at the end of the season and that's the supposed reason he didn't play against us.

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/loic-remy/verletzungen/spieler/45121

Whilst I understand that it may be damage limitation as QPR wouldn't want 'damaged goods' to try to move on if Remy doesn't want to stay at QPR, it just seems odd that us and QPR have an agreement, which Rodgers has stuck to, yet QPR, through whoever, don't seem to be sticking to the agreement.
I'm sure Brendan would like to defend the club against accusations that it's because Borini won't move, as Sky Sports, through their 'sources are reporting, as it makes us look daft agreeing a transfer fee with Sunderland, arranging contracts, medicals, shirt numbers etc with Borini's "replacement" without checking first that Borini is actually prepared to leave, especially if we can't afford both Borini and Remy.
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Offline barticus

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #273 on: July 28, 2014, 07:56:43 PM »
I think it must be the injury. With the Suarez money and the extra coming from Champions league, then if we can't afford 8.5 mil then we might as well give up on top 4 already.

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #274 on: July 28, 2014, 08:25:14 PM »
I think it must be the injury. With the Suarez money and the extra coming from Champions league, then if we can't afford 8.5 mil then we might as well give up on top 4 already.

The thing is when you look at the entire deal you can start to see how ridiculous wages are.

Transfer fee £8.5M + £80k per week x 5 years = £29.3M (that's without FA fees, VAT, agent fees etc)

If Borini's transfer fee is £12M + £2M add ons simplistically it leaves £3.5M surplus. 3 years left on contract, let's guess at £40K a week = £6.24M

So we stand to save/recoup £9.74M, leaving £19.56M as the very rough cost/commitment to make the Remy deal happen. Obviously all that is hypothetical/media derived and very, very simplistic but still it illustrates the sort of outlay we'd be looking at.

Also the Origi deal has been 'in the air' for a while and was only finalised at about the same time as Remy's medical and maybe Borini's insistance on stopping. Maybe we simply couldn't afford the financial commitment having all 3 would have left us facing, so it could have been Origi, not Borini, that's seen the deal flounder.

Also there's the question of insurance. If we can't insure Remy fully because of any medical situation then maybe that was a deciding factor. Newcastle may have decided to go ahead last Summer as their commitment was 1 season of wages and a loan fee. QPR may have inserted the low buy out fees to partly mitigate insurance problems in that they could move him on reasonably easily should there be a possible need to and they took the chance on Remy only being there for 6 months if they didn't avoid relegation. If they did then they have a greater income. I've no idea how financially prudent QPR's owner is and we know Harry likes to spend, and is a very persuasive character.

Newcastle have been linked with Carroll, Remy of course, and Alexandre Lacazette of Lyon, who we've also been heavily linked with and are being again post Remy. All 3 are around the same sort of value. It will be interesting to see if they do go back in for Remy.

Also different consultants take different views on the same condition. Maybe the consultant we dealt with holds different views and interpretations to the other consultants/doctors used by previous clubs and the French national team. 

What we do next, what happens to Borini and Remy for that matter, will probably paint a clearer picture, or when Remy gets back to London and he or his agent/representatives talk to Harry, Harry will kindly put us in the picture. 
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Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #275 on: July 28, 2014, 11:04:47 PM »
No Liverpool Loic Remy transfer U-turn pledges Rodgers as he prepares to sign Divock Origi

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/no-liverpool-loic-remy-transfer-3927597

So is it finally being certain we'll get Origi that has made us drop out of the Remy purchase? It wasn't until about the same time as the delay 'over paperwork' started that it became more clear we would be getting him, especially with Atletico Madrid making a last minute all-out attempt to get him.

An interesting line from the Mirror article: " It is understood Liverpool took several opinions from top specialists before pulling the plug on the deal

Whether it's the Mirror's take or what, but this is the first time there's been mention of multiple opinions and the degree of checks (if it's true of course) must have meant it was quite a borderline problem.

I await Harry to update us soon.
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Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #276 on: July 29, 2014, 12:19:03 AM »
From: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/queens-park-rangers/10996475/QPR-manager-Harry-Redknapp-doubts-claims-that-Loic-Remys-move-to-Liverpool-fell-through-on-medical-grounds.html

" QPR were aware that Rémy has a historic heart condition, but do not think it would cause a problem with a medical after making extra checks on the issue before signing the player in January 2013.

 Rémy was cleared to play for Marseille in 2010, despite the discovery of a heart problem during his initial medical with the French club. Further tests showed that the condition was no obstacle to his football career.

Marseille doctor Christophe Baudot said the heart specialists who dealt with Rémy the second time round could find no reason to prevent him practising sport at a high level.
"

" The London club now expect him back by the end of this week. "  That should prove interesting.
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Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #277 on: July 29, 2014, 12:43:29 AM »
From: http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/493019/Harry-Redknapp-s-shock-at-Loic-Remy-s-medical-mystery

" The Reds spent a significant amount of money not to only get Remy to the US but then to undergo a two-day medical in Boston hospitals.
It was also a time-consuming process as they were in unfamiliar surroundings with facilities that were set up for baseball player medicals.
"

So when asked to do a medical for football, Remy was found unfit to play Gridiron.  ;D

Wasps and the London Broncos have both enquired about Remy's availibility.
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Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #278 on: July 29, 2014, 10:36:58 AM »
He's another possibility re Remy:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2144514-should-liverpool-target-wissam-ben-yedder-after-loic-remys-failed-medical


" What probably transpired was Liverpool's medical team informed the front office of Remy's medical baggage.

In response, Liverpool leveraged Remy to renegotiate his salary.

He refused and it led to what Rodgers described as "unfortunate for the player," per Dominic King at the Daily Mail.

This has happened before under Liverpool owner John W Henry's leadership, albeit in a different sport.

First baseman Mike Napoli lost $34 million due to a failed medical, per ESPN:

Mike Napoli will sign a one-year deal with the Boston Red Sox, sources told ESPN on Thursday.
Napoli's contract is for one year with a base salary of $5 million, sources told ESPN's Buster Olney.
The deal comes more than six weeks after Napoli agreed to a three-year, $39 million deal with Boston.
That deal was taken off the table when Napoli, in the judgement of the team's medical staff, failed his physical.
"

But if this is the case didn't the manager or transfer committee communicate Remy's known heart condition to Ayre and the owners so that value and contract levels could be set with all information known and if they weren't prepared to pay him 'market value' in his contract, then having all the info before the contract offer would have meant they could offer accordingly and then it would be Remy's decision.

I hope we don't come out of this having made an avoidable mistake through poor communication (all this took place in the city of the owners, Boston), or proving to have lied, or at least allowed misinformation to become the accepted explanation without correcting it.
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Offline barticus

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #279 on: July 29, 2014, 04:56:50 PM »
i know this is fantasy football but evidently Marco Reus is available and we're leading as faves to sign! with remy not signing maybe its a sign!

http://forums.lfconline.com/showthread.php?t=187445

Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #280 on: July 29, 2014, 07:44:52 PM »
i know this is fantasy football but evidently Marco Reus is available and we're leading as faves to sign! with remy not signing maybe its a sign!

http://forums.lfconline.com/showthread.php?t=187445

Meanwhile back at L4 Shane Long proclaims how he's just fulfilled a lifelong dream signing for Liverpool.  ;D
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Offline the dude abides

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #281 on: July 29, 2014, 07:49:31 PM »
good spot, Tes re possible renogiation of Remy's salary.

But if so, I am glad that our owners are now being very stringent re medicals.

Maybe our owners have been pissed off with so many players that we buy, being then out with long term injuries.

I welcome their approach - we are talking big transfer fees and salaries.....if there is some medical doubt, then any contract has to reflect that - and go with a low base salary figure.


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Offline the dude abides

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #282 on: July 29, 2014, 07:53:04 PM »
i know this is fantasy football but evidently Marco Reus is available and we're leading as faves to sign! with remy not signing maybe its a sign!

http://forums.lfconline.com/showthread.php?t=187445

exciting if we could pull it off

he's only 25 years old.

though him and his agents might merely be flirting with other clubs, merely to get dortmund to increase their wages on offer, for his new contract.
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Offline Tes

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #283 on: July 30, 2014, 12:44:50 AM »
good spot, Tes re possible renegotiation of Remy's salary.

But if so, I am glad that our owners are now being very stringent re medicals.

Maybe our owners have been pissed off with so many players that we buy, being then out with long term injuries.

I welcome their approach - we are talking big transfer fees and salaries.....if there is some medical doubt, then any contract has to reflect that - and go with a low base salary figure.

Totally agree Dude. These are huge numbers in terms of the commitment the club makes on each player. Whilst the fee was relatively cheap, though only in football (and probably UK house valuations  ;D) can the sum of £8,500,000 be regarded as 'cheap', as with most players the real financial commitment is the salary and term length of the contract. Remy's was reported as being circa £80k a week over 5 years. That's £20,800,000 basic and we don't know what bonuses and 'signing on fee' (a totally ridiculous concept in this day and age) there are on top. That's a minimum commitment of £29,300,000 the club has to make.
If Remy has a known condition of any type it could make getting insurance more difficult or the pre-known condition wouldn't be payable on if it became the reason he couldn't continue. We would have to continue paying him until the end of his contract.

Maybe the owners weren't initially aware of his heart condition prior to the contract negotiation, but once they'd seen the medical reports decided they wouldn't sign off on that salary with his heart condition, especially if they'd done it before with the Red Sox.

QPR knew that he wouldn't be there for his entire contract, Newcastle borrowed him for a year, but we were looking at 5 years, by which time he's 32/33, and obviously the older he gets the more chance of there potentially being a problem. You can understand why we were more cautious than Marseille, QPR, Newcastle and the French national team.

When you look at the known 'sicknotes' we've signed, or those that became 'sicknotes' you can see why caution has been used in this case.

The more you read about Remy's character and the little things he's pulled, the less savioury a sort of character he seems. Certainly, he's no Dirk Kuyt.
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Offline the dude abides

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Re: Summer Transfer Window 2014
« Reply #284 on: July 30, 2014, 01:28:34 AM »
afte
When you look at the known 'sicknotes' we've signed, or those that became 'sicknotes' you can see why caution has been used in this case.

The more you read about Remy's character and the little things he's pulled, the less savioury a sort of character he seems. Certainly, he's no Dirk Kuyt.

you know, maybe for all we know, our owners are pissed right now, with seeing Lallallana injured for 6 weeks.  Maybe that has spurred us to be very tight on medicals...............or, as you say, maybe getting insurance cover is a big issue (on such expensive wage contracts).

I hadn't seen anything on Remy's character - I am guessing here - big headed type? 

I do recall reading that he seemed to lose interest at Newcastle (with the rest of the ship in similar mode)
In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.