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Author Topic: We Are Good Enough!  (Read 2872 times)

Offline Ed

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We Are Good Enough!
« on: December 15, 2009, 02:15:07 AM »
Eeeeeeh the forum is bubbling over again with the usual haters!

I admit there have been problems this season and Rafa takes his fair share of the blame (not disproportionate though! Anyway he's not the messiah he's the gaffer).

Hand on my heart I Believe (nice word!) in the first 11! I love these guys, think they're good enough and WILL HAPPILY SUPPORT THEM ALL SEASON LONG:

Reina
Johnson
Carragher
Agger
Aurelio
Benayoun
Masch
Aquilani/Lucas
Kuyt
Gerrard
Torres

YNWA

Offline Kopite999

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2009, 01:36:46 PM »
I agree.The reason alot of fans are dissapointed is because after the way Rafa got the team playing last season, many thought this could be the year. I've no doubt we can turn it all around once our big guns start firing. And on the manager, get behind him and the team until the end of the sesaon and see where we are then.

Offline Redman

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2009, 03:14:35 PM »
Yeah we're good enough and I still think we'll finish in the top 4, 4th mind you unless a major collapse from Chelski, Arsenal and the Scum  ;)

Redman
“Let the future tell the truth, and evaluate each one according to his work and accomplishments. The present is theirs; the future, for which I have really worked, is mine.”

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Offline the dude abides

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2009, 06:23:35 PM »
well said Ed, redman and kopite.

The game is all about confidence.  And we have gone through an awful time.

Last season we were able to fight back when things went against us (remember all those daring late wins at the start of the season).  Now it's the opposite.  Our heads drop when we go behind.  And we are conceding far too many sucker punches and late goals.

But if we finish down the table (this reminds me of that last bad season, under souness, where we finished 7th or 8th IIRC), then so-be-it.

I have no doubts about the quality of our starting eleven.  There is world class quality across the team.   If we can get our finances off the pitch in order....and a major input of capital.....then things will get a lot easier.

On the pitch, we just need a rub of the green.  We just need to start grinding out results, by whatever means.  That is what Ferguson always does....that is what we did at Liverpool, in the golden era, when we were up against the wall.  Great teams can grind out results.

We just need to go on a run....and get some confidence back.





In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

Offline Juan

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2009, 10:34:52 PM »
But if we finish down the table (this reminds me of that last bad season, under souness, where we finished 7th or 8th IIRC), then so-be-it.

This may sound like an odd comment, and its not something i would have contemplated before now but is there at all a possibility that missing out on Champions league football next season could actually be the positive catalyst we need?

Dont get me wrong i want to see Liverpool in Europes top competition year in year out.

However since the Americans took over in 2007 the club has been at war. If its not Hicks vs Gillett, its Rafa vs Gillett or the fans versus Hicks and Gillett. Id say for the first time in the clubs history the different factions of LFC cant seem to agree on anything. There was a time when it looked as though DIC amongst others would be our white knight and rescue the club from its nightmare but nothing ever materialized largely down to the fact that the club was grossly overvalued by the American pair.

So if the club is in such financial turmoil at the moment would losing out on the vital funds generated by at least qualifying for the champions league not be the straw that breaks the Americans backs? Would it not bring the ownership farce to a head?

Something has had to give at LFC for quiet some time, my argument is that would missing out on the Champions finally force everyone connected to LFC to face up to whats gone wrong and force people to set about ending the war?


Offline Ageing Stick Insect

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2009, 11:00:59 PM »
We might be good enough on paper but the team is mentally fragile and shows no signs of coming out of that mindset. When I find myself checking the Birmingham score and becoming concerned that they're winning their 5th consecutive game then things are becoming very serious for LFC.

If Arsenal win tomorrow night, Spurs lose and we fail to win then we could be 9 or 10 points off 4th place and Arsenal still have a game in hand so it could be 13!

Even a win would leave us 7 points adrift with games at Portsmouth and home to Wolves. Those should be bankers but I've seen two false dawns now and still no sign of the team settling down.

And what does Rafa do today? Guarantee we will finish in 4th!  :o Bloody hell Rafa - how can you be so stupid. As things stand we cannot guarantee anything of the sort. You only guarantee things that you have complete control over.

It sounds to be as though some at the club are starting to panic with Jamie admitting he prays every night for a recovery and now Rafa coming out with this rubbish today.

I do believe Torres and Gerrard will stay in the summer but Masch will probably go and so will other less talented players. As to whether we finish in a Euro position this season? Who knows? Certainly not on current form. These are desperate times.  :(
Cheers,
Ray



Offline the dude abides

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2009, 07:23:32 PM »
This may sound like an odd comment, and its not something i would have contemplated before now but is there at all a possibility that missing out on Champions league football next season could actually be the positive catalyst we need?

So if the club is in such financial turmoil at the moment would losing out on the vital funds generated by at least qualifying for the champions league not be the straw that breaks the Americans backs? Would it not bring the ownership farce to a head?

Something has had to give at LFC for quiet some time, my argument is that would missing out on the Champions finally force everyone connected to LFC to face up to whats gone wrong and force people to set about ending the war?

I agree with you, Juan.

If the club does finish outside the top four places (maybe even well outside the top four), then it might be the best thing, for the long term stability of the club.

Suddenly, the notion that we can automatically qualify every year for the CL, will be shown up, for the financial lunacy that it represented.   

Non-qualification for next year's CL, will also mean new investors will be able to buy into the club for much more sensible amounts.  The banks will also put far more pressure on our owners.

My only fear is that our owners would sack Rafa, in the close season.  If they go that route, then we will truly be heading into the football wilderness.


In the midst of winter, I finally learned that there was, in me, an invincible summer.

There’s no next time. It’s now or never.

centenaryjonny

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2009, 05:05:45 PM »
Our first 11 isnt far off what is needed but the problem comes when we get passed that, there is very little.  You cannot expect to win the league with 11 players. And especially when out of those 11, one or two arent goos enough anyway!

Aurellio? Come on, he's far from world class, hes never even been capped!  To be 29 and not capped for your country means that you are not good enough at the top level.  Both goals against Arsenal came from balls that he offered no attempt to stop being crossed

Lucas?  Its amazing how peoples expectations soon drop!  Lucas is average, again far from world class!  He's a squad player, there is nothing that you would say is his strength, passing? shooting? tackling? heading? He is cover and nothing more, so cant be included in a 'world class 11'

Kuyt? As a right sided midfielder/winger his main duties are not tracking back, or tackling, he is there to put balls in for Torres or Gerrard. And he is incapable of doing this.  He has no pace, very little control of the ball and a truly shocking first touch, so again, should be there for cover for Torres, or Gerrard, after all he is a striker!

Aqualani? He needs to play before any judgement is made, so again cant be included in a 'world class 11' as no one knows what he can and cant do or if he is actually any good!  First impressions, he does seem to have a bit about him, good first touch and good vision, but too early to judge.

So when you take these players away, we are 3 or 4 players away from having anything close to a 'world class 11' in my humble opinion.  And like I said, you cant win the league with 11 players anyway, let alone 8!

Rafa has had 5 years, and 76 players to build a SQUAD, not a team, and this is what he has come up with so far.  As Ive said in the past, take Gerrard and Cara away (as they were already there) and there are 6 or 7 players from 76 that he has bought that are a success! 

Dont forget also that he has had 5 years of young players coming through that have failed to make the grade either because they are not good enough (scouts and coaching staff) or because Rafa doesnt have the guts to try them!

To have 6 or 7 players to show for 76 signings means that 1 in 10 is a success, or that 9 out of 10 are not!!

A simple fact, if they were good enough they would win stuff, which have failed to do for the past 3 years!

Rafa needs to concentrate on quality not quantity as this does clearly not work.  We have one of the biggest squads in europe, packed full of player who arent good enough that we are paying every week!


Red Jesus

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2009, 05:15:22 PM »
Our first 11 isnt far off what is needed but the problem comes when we get passed that, there is very little.  You cannot expect to win the league with 11 players. And especially when out of those 11, one or two arent goos enough anyway!

Kuyt? As a right sided midfielder/winger his main duties are not tracking back, or tackling, he is there to put balls in for Torres or Gerrard. And he is incapable of doing this.  He has no pace, very little control of the ball and a truly shocking first touch, so again, should be there for cover for Torres, or Gerrard, after all he is a striker!


I disagree with you when you say that our first 11 is okay, and it is for people like kuyt being included in that makes me dis agree.  Kuyts second touch of the ball is 9 times out of 10 a tackle.  We need more of a cutting edge and Yossi has provided us with that since the Madrid game and Fabio also does that.  We need more players with skill not just yard dogs like Kuyt, if we had more skillfull players then Kuyt would be alright I suppose as a squad player but when the chips are down and we need a goal watching Kuyt run around like a headless chicken, losing the ball everytime he gets it because his first touch lets him down is extremely frustrating.

centenaryjonny

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Re: We Are Good Enough!
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2009, 05:33:14 PM »
I disagree with you when you say that our first 11 is okay, and it is for people like kuyt being included in that makes me dis agree.  Kuyts second touch of the ball is 9 times out of 10 a tackle.  We need more of a cutting edge and Yossi has provided us with that since the Madrid game and Fabio also does that.  We need more players with skill not just yard dogs like Kuyt, if we had more skillfull players then Kuyt would be alright I suppose as a squad player but when the chips are down and we need a goal watching Kuyt run around like a headless chicken, losing the ball everytime he gets it because his first touch lets him down is extremely frustrating.

I'm afraid that skill comes behind tracking back, 'working hard' and obbeying Rafas negative orders in Rafas world!  We play two defensive midfielders at home every game, we have 4 defenders on the bench, we play defenders as wingers, we have one striker at home, we dont use skill, we simply hoof the ball up to Torres to chase until his hamstring goes again. 

Dirk should be used merely as cover, not the first name on the teamsheet