Anfield Road - Liverpool FC Forum

Football and lesser sports => Liverpool FC, football, sport => Topic started by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 05:32:53 PM

Title: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 05:32:53 PM
Me and Dude have argued on this subject for ages. What does everyone else think?
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 05:36:35 PM
Gerrard 10 TOP Goals

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGATeOswER0&feature=related
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 05:37:20 PM
why are you incapable of discussing issues - as opposed to this endless hero worship.

discuss the thing - rather than hold some meaningless poll.


Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 05:44:54 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2LEeAjEMFU

THIS is the real mccoy.

Souness was the business.   

By a country mile, he was the best central Liverpool midfielder of all time. IMHO
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 05:47:49 PM
whys it meaningless? coz it makes you look stupid for questioning such an LFC legend? In my opinion he's in the clubs top 2 of best ever Liverpool players. If not top 2 he's at least in the top 5?
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 05:51:28 PM
whys it meaningless? coz it makes you look stupid for questioning such an LFC legend? In my opinion he's in the clubs top 2 of best ever Liverpool players. If not top 2 he's at least in the top 5?

it's meaningless hero worship........childish phone-in-show type fare.

if he wasn't english, he'd get 20 percent of the media acclaim.

what do you expect the answer to be.

what's your next poll - was hitler a bad man or a legend?

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Juan on November 03, 2010, 05:55:23 PM
why are you incapable of discussing issues - as opposed to this endless hero worship.

discuss the thing - rather than hold some meaningless poll.

I dont want to get between your differences on Gerrard. To give my opinion on the guy I think he has consistently dragged this club to levels that probably wouldn't have been achievable were he not at the club. From the time he made his debut as a talented headless chicken who cut people in two hes grown and become the heart beat of the club for a decade.

He could have played with any club in the world with the best players in the world but he chose (admittedly with a little controversy) to stay and continue to give LFC a sporting chance.

No footballer is worth worshiping but I would have no problems in acknowledging the contribution Gerrard has served Liverpool with over the years that makes him a Liverpool legend.

His form last year wasnt as it had been in the past but if anyone was allowed an off season he was. I still see him as our most consistent player and hes still playing with players not fit to lace his boots.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 06:06:14 PM
what do you expect the answer to be? all your information and views are online.  I'm lucky enough to live and breathe the club and our fans first hand. I talk to real fans who actually go to games and I dont live on my computer talking about a team 1000's of miles away. I've missed 5 homes in ten years and seen just how good Stevie is. As much as TV coverage can be good you cant assess a players work ethic by TV. A football pitch in real life isnt 32/37/42 inches!! 
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 06:12:00 PM
p.s no ones questioning Souness's ability. From what i've seen of footage of him he was a great player that is unfairly tarnished by his managerial spell. What people forget is that without Souness, Fowler and McManaman might not have reached the heights they did. Fowler especially heaps praise on Souness for giving his chance
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 06:22:38 PM
what do you expect the answer to be? all your information and views are online.  I'm lucky enough to live and breathe the club and our fans first hand. I talk to real fans who actually go to games and I dont live on my computer talking about a team 1000's of miles away. I've missed 5 homes in ten years and seen just how good Stevie is. As much as TV coverage can be good you cant assess a players work ethic by TV. A football pitch in real life isnt 32/37/42 inches!!

So go ahead and tell me - Hitler, bad man or legend?   The Beatles, tripe or legend? 

You've not seen Liverpool when they bossed england (and europe).  You came along ten minutes ago. 

Look at Man Utd - anyone gets big ideas about themelves, Fergie ships them out.  (just you watch rooney's career path in the next season or two).

Personal ego and teams, are not a good match.

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Ed on November 03, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
Stevie G.....certainly his contribution to the club has been massive.....BUT He's a cup player and we'll never win the league under his captaincy, he can't do the Istanbul thing away in the league to rubbish teams, so instead he clings (rather selfishly IMO) to the mr. Liverpool thing and we get a new manager when it doesn't work out!
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 06:37:48 PM
So whiskey nose wanted rid of Ronaldo then? His ego's bigger than Stam and Horse face put together.

You failing to see what we would have been like without Gerrard in the past 10 years baffles me.

It's pretty well known dude that when we dominated europe we had a team of class acts not just one
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Clem on November 03, 2010, 06:48:19 PM
Gotta say though, in an all-time LFC cm Souness and Stevie G would be pretty formidable
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 06:52:33 PM
So whiskey nose wanted rid of Ronaldo then? His ego's bigger than Stam and Horse face put together.

You failing to see what we would have been like without Gerrard in the past 10 years baffles me.

It's pretty well known dude that when we dominated europe we had a team of class acts not just one

fergie sanctioned ronaldo's sale........fergie sanctioned beckham's sale..............fergie sanctioned stam's sale...............and wait and see, but there is a fair chance he rooney will be out on his ear in one of the next few transfer windows too.   You get too big for your boots, or cross him....and Fergie cuts you out.  He is a most unforgiving bugger.

when we dominated europe, we didn't have this endless hero worshop of an individual.

Indeed Bob Paisley pointedly refused, in interviews after games, to talk at any length about individuals.  It's a team game.  The TEAM is everything.

The media built Gerrard into something that he wasn't........mainly because he was english.

Do you think Clough or Paisley would put up with his gifting of possession to the opposition - time after time - with endless poor passes?  Do you think they'd put up with his lack of tactical discipline.  Or his 100MPH ''passes" 

Look at that Souness video......look at his properly weighted passes (do they look anything like gerrard's efforts?). 

Against Bruges at Wembley, in the european cup final, for our winner, Gerrard would probably have decapitated Dalglish (in trying to play him in for the goal). 


Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 07:00:44 PM
He's a cup player and we'll never win the league under his captaincy, he can't do the Istanbul thing away in the league to rubbish teams, so instead he clings (rather selfishly IMO) to the mr. Liverpool thing and we get a new manager when it doesn't work out!

agreed, Ed.   

It's eventually always someone else's fault and they pay the price.

A top club needs a strong-willed manager, to keep any egos in check.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 07:03:26 PM
Dude the question isnt a trick question. Its not is souness better than Gerrard or vice versa. Or was the 70's team better than Gerrard. It says is Gerrard a greedy capitalist pig as quoted by yourself or is he an LFC legend? 
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 07:05:49 PM
Dude the question isnt a trick question. Its not is souness better than Gerrard or vice versa. Or was the 70's team better than Gerrard. It says is Gerrard a greedy capitalist pig as quoted by yourself or is he an LFC legend?

and like i said previously, such a poll is childish and meaningless.

what's your next poll gonna be - Hitler, bad man or legend?
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Ed on November 03, 2010, 07:07:37 PM
The other point is Souness was a tough B**tard....IMO that element has always been missing from Gerrard's game...hate to mention him, but look at Keane, borderline psychopath (top player!)....again IMO to win the league it's essential to master the art of winning ugly, Hollywood passes, Hollywood tackles and Hollywood goals is all very well for Steven Gerrard BUT to win the midfield, win the game, win the league sometimes THERE NEEDS TO BE A PLAN B, and it's not necessarily from Hollywood.....
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 07:15:12 PM
The other point is Souness was a tough B**tard....IMO that element has always been missing from Gerrard's game...hate to mention him, but look at Keane, borderline psychopath (top player!)....again IMO to win the league it's essential to master the art of winning ugly, Hollywood passes, Hollywood tackles and Hollywood goals is all very well for Steven Gerrard BUT to win the midfield, win the game, win the league sometimes THERE NEEDS TO BE A PLAN B, and it's not necessarily from Hollywood.....

yes, souness had many strings to his bow.

he was a tough bugger, but also could be subtle when necessary.

he was a very smart player......both tactically and also how he dealt with ongoing issues (off the ball, if necessary).

you have to win the right to play your game......and if that had to be ugly, or very defensive (away from home say in europe), then we could do that. 

imagine if souness was english and playing in 2010.   I hope the modern hero worship wouldn't have turned his head.....and made his perm fatter.     

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 07:15:42 PM
It all adds up. Gerrard got your love child the sack. Thats why you hate him so much :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 07:31:28 PM
and like i said previously, such a poll is childish and meaningless.

what's your next poll gonna be - Hitler, bad man or legend?

The reason i posted the poll is because i'm fed up with every time Gerrards names mentioned on this site you have a 'childish' dig at him. Why bother we know your view. He's our current club captain and whether you agree or not Liverpool football club today would be in a far worse place had he not been in our team for the past 10 years.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 07:37:32 PM
And reference to Hitler. Apparently he was a big red

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfH9vBatIPw
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Clem on November 03, 2010, 09:53:51 PM
that is brilliant - end up like those ferret-shaggers at Leeds ;D
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Ed on November 03, 2010, 10:09:08 PM
Yeah, but he wasn't much of a "precious Stevie (swear word here!) G" fan! :P
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 03, 2010, 11:08:02 PM
Yeah, but he wasn't much of a "precious Stevie (swear word here!) G" fan! :P

 :D :D
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Gurdeep on November 03, 2010, 11:29:10 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2LEeAjEMFU

THIS is the real mccoy.

Souness was the business.   

By a country mile, he was the best central Liverpool midfielder of all time. IMHO

Wow.....vintage Souness.  Loved the music to :)
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 03, 2010, 11:35:53 PM
Wow.....vintage Souness.  Loved the music to :)

brings back great memories, gurdeep.  A wonderful time.

@ kopite -   :D          I actually did a Hitler/liverpool video (based on that footage) a year or two back.

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: JohnnyH on November 04, 2010, 02:25:16 PM
I think the Dude is doing a great disservice to Gerrard with some of his comments.  Gerrard has played many stunning weighted passes for Owen in the past and Torres now.  I was just looking at the Bolton game from a few season back last night and the ball into Torres was stunning.  However, Gerrard is also prone to the 100mph passes that the Dude refers to and then having a moan when the recipient can't control it (A goalkeeper would have done well to tip the pass over the bar!) 

I do think that Gerrard and Carra probably have a little too much power at the club and that concerns me on occasion, but having said that, I wouldn’t want them anywhere else so I suppose that can happen when someone is there that long. 

Souness was and is my favourite ever Liverpool player and I agree that he is our best ever midfielder.  Yes he was poor as manager and his major fork up with the S*n will always blight his standing here, but as a player he was utterly amazing.  But this doesn’t and shouldn’t take away what Gerrard has done.  I think it’ll only be when Gerrard packs it all in that people will really realize how special he was.  His performance and goal catalogue is quite astonishing.  I also think Gerrard suffers somewhat in the new media age, and I think Souness would have suffered just as much were he a player today.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Clem on November 04, 2010, 02:39:40 PM
Good points JohnnyH.
Souness was a fantastic leader on the pitch too, especially in tough games away in Europe, or in very physical league games. One thing that does split these guys though (although I do think the comparison is a little inconclusive because they don't play in the same roles for their teams) is that Souness left us in 1984 and headed for Sampdoria.  There was something about a tax incentive for his wife's business interests if I remember correctly.  Whatever, he left us in the lurch and we under-performed the following season and won nothing. He went just the same as did Owen, McManaman and a few others - thinking about themselves first and LFC second.  Gerrard has been a lifelong fan and stuck with us when other players might have despaired - he deserves respect for that alone.  He's a cracking player on his day too.  They're both LFC legends, even if Gerrard never got to perform in as great a side.  Maybe his best comparison would be Liddle in a way (not exact same position either) because he carried the team a lot when he played too. Anyway its a moot point - neither were/are fit to lace the boots of the mighty Igor!!! :P
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 04, 2010, 03:55:53 PM
I also think Gerrard suffers somewhat in the new media age, and I think Souness would have suffered just as much were he a player today.

yes, I raised this same issue yesterday.

Souness, would have had his head turned, if he had been playing today.  What would save him, to a good extent, would be his nationality. 

If Graeme was english, the media would create statues to him.  And created a religion with him at it's center.

It takes a very strong person, mentally, to not be affected.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 04, 2010, 10:01:53 PM
couldn't hit a barn door against bolton or blackburn, then runs rampant tonight.

he's done well tonight.  Great game chaser. 

good time to flog him.





Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Ed on November 04, 2010, 11:23:38 PM
Kopite999, it was a sublime hat-trick and I've no problem giving him his dues on this occasion....I hope he's as fired up against Chelsea!
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 05, 2010, 12:48:10 AM
TBH if i was in Gerrards shoes i'd leave us tomorrow. We were absolutely awful for 70-75mins tonight. Anyone see the ultra's banner? I tried translating it on my phone but as always at Anfield  signal is pretty shitty. The first bit was 'Anfield Road niente.......' and there was another one. If someone saw them and knows what it said i'm intrigued to know.  Napoli fans were f@cking everywhere tonight. Horrible knob ends
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Gurdeep on November 05, 2010, 07:10:55 AM
Looks he saved Hodgson's bacon.....twit, I want him out  :P :P :P
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 05, 2010, 11:54:14 AM
aye, he's saved Woy's bacon at least for 2010.

see what a good kick up the ass does tho.  no more hero worship, more kicks up the ass to keep his feet on the ground.

I've said for years, that he'd make a great david fairclough.......a super-sub.


Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 05, 2010, 12:00:57 PM
aye, he's saved Woy's bacon at least for 2010.

see what a good kick up the ass does tho.  no more hero worship, more kicks up the ass to keep his feet on the ground.

I've said for years, that he'd make a great david fairclough.......a super-sub.

 ;D

Dont think i need to reply to that after last night. ;)

We are a very very poor team.Whethers its our squad depth or Roy i cant decide :-\
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 05, 2010, 12:11:07 PM
;D

Dont think i need to reply to that after last night. ;)

We are a very very poor team.Whethers its our squad depth or Roy i cant decide :-\

I've said it for years, there's no better player to bring off the bench when we're chasing a game, kopite.

where chaos and inaction reigns supreme, direct action by captain marvel often reaps reward.

e.g. their keeper didn't fancy it for that opening goal.

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 05, 2010, 01:35:41 PM
Maybe it'll set a trend. Every game every team must stick their best players on the bench and arent allowed to bring them on until half time. Sounds like a plan. If we did that in the premiership we'd be 4-0 down at half time every game, because we've got a squad that without Gerrard, Torres and Reina thats no better than Stoke City
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 05, 2010, 01:55:58 PM

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/he-s-the-best-we-ve-ever-had

'He's the best we've ever had'

Jamie Carragher today reflected on Steven Gerrard's stunning Napoli hat-trick and declared: 'He's the best player we've ever had.'

With Liverpool trailing by a goal at half-time, the captain came off the bench to fire a second-half treble and help the Reds to a 3-1 victory over the Italian club on Thursday night.

It puts Roy Hodgson's side on the brink of qualification for the knockout stages of the Europa League - and Carragher is eager to laud the qualities that have made Gerrard one of the world's most outstanding talents.

"Stevie is just an unbelievable talent, we all know that," he said. "We have seen him do things like he did last night time and again during his career.

"But he keeps on producing when it matters and, to me, that makes him the best player the club has ever had and the most influential player ever in the Premier League.

"You could see the crowd responded to him when he came on in the second half and he lifted everybody's performance. He was outstanding and we were able to get out of a tight spot.

"Thankfully we were able to get the win and now we have got to make sure we can keep this run going for as long as possible."

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 05, 2010, 02:03:22 PM
Maybe it'll set a trend. Every game every team must stick their best players on the bench and arent allowed to bring them on until half time. Sounds like a plan. If we did that in the premiership we'd be 4-0 down at half time every game, because we've got a squad that without Gerrard, Torres and Reina thats no better than Stoke City

Stoke were above us in the table until we stole the three points with that late winner on Sunday at Bolton.

Reina has been world class this season, as always.  Without him, we'd be bottom of the pile.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 05, 2010, 02:08:18 PM
Jamie Carragher says of his best mate: "Stevie keeps on producing when it matters"

apart from against the boltons and blackburns of this world.


Jamie goes on to say:  "Stevie's the best player the club has ever had and the most influential player ever in the Premier League."

so why were we in the relegation area til last weekend?

why do we rarely compete for league titles?

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Juan on November 05, 2010, 02:24:53 PM
so why were we in the relegation area til last weekend?

why do we rarely compete for league titles?

Dude in fairness to Gerrard he cant win titles single handed. If we had players with half as much talent and contribution as Gerrard in every area of the pitch we would have number 19, 20, 21 and many more titles by now.

Look at Newcastle with Shearer. Even though he was so good for so log at Newcastle and scored so many goals he couldn't bring them the league on his own.

 
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 05, 2010, 02:39:09 PM
Like you have said dude on numerous occaisions, a team involves more than one contributing. He cant where his blue costume with big 's' on it everyweek. Anyway i doubt theres any Kryptonite left, after the amount of times he's dug us out of a hole over the years. I personally would have sent him to rescue the Chilean miners ;)
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 05, 2010, 03:24:46 PM
 :D  @ chilean miners

but don't we see the same excuses pulled out all the time.

are we also saying england also fail because stevie has nobody decent to play alongside him?

the reality IMHO is that teams cannot function properly without disciplined individuals.  Maradona was an exception......you gave him the ball, even if you were a journey-man, and he beat the opposition on his own, lots of the time.

I've always maintained that Stevie is Liverpool's version of Utd's Bryan Robson.  A super hero who's role ill-fits in a properly firing top team.

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 05, 2010, 03:31:59 PM
I dont think anyone on this forum follows England TBH

'We're not English, we are Scouse'
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 05, 2010, 03:41:42 PM
I dont think anyone on this forum follows England TBH

'We're not English, we are Scouse'

that's all very well - but the point still is that the england level failures too, make the much used excuse of "he doesn't have decent colleagues to play with" seem pretty lame.

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 05, 2010, 03:55:51 PM
Englands failings would take days to list. The 'Golden Generation' tag was utter crap. They had 3 world class players. Gerrard, Rooney and Terry. Thats not a generation. Great teams that do well at finals except Greece, have class on the pitch and on the bench. Look at Spain and the depth theyve got. Hence they are successful. With England if Wayne 'GRANNY SHAGGER' Rooney gets injured or is out of form, theyve got Heskey or Bent to step in.

Anyway i refuse to talk England anymore. I've got a stinking hangover from last night and talking England is making it worse. 8)
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 05, 2010, 04:32:36 PM
Englands failings would take days to list. The 'Golden Generation' tag was utter crap. They had 3 world class players. Gerrard, Rooney and Terry. Thats not a generation. Great teams that do well at finals except Greece, have class on the pitch and on the bench. Look at Spain and the depth theyve got. Hence they are successful. With England if Wayne 'GRANNY SHAGGER' Rooney gets injured or is out of form, theyve got Heskey or Bent to step in.

Anyway i refuse to talk England anymore. I've got a stinking hangover from last night and talking England is making it worse. 8)

teams like greece and denmark can win championships, and they don't have so-called world class superstars.

holland can get to the world cup final and didn't have many megastars in their outfit.  Rooney was p**s poor for england.....as was gerrard.

in the modern age, the media create these megastars.

personally, I like teams and how they function.

re alcohol - big festival here all week (panama)..........mucho alcohol consumed by masses.  I had a few....but necessary to work today.....mucho concrete.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Ed on November 05, 2010, 06:34:34 PM
Hmmmm...I'm not getting too carried away with the Gerrard Hat-trick (though I was blown away by Lucas's tackle, to set up the third!) I mean there's a huge difference between scoring in your own back yard, in the Europa league (for a player like Gerrard, it's probably the equivalent of another player doing well against the reserves!) and what he was capable of against Europe's elite 5 years ago!

I enjoyed the goals and loved the way he silenced the Napoli fans, but the bar is always going to be higher when it comes to Gerrard.....let's see if was a freakish turning back the years in a career that's on the wane or whether he can captain the side to victory against Chelsea on Sunday....
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Clem on November 05, 2010, 08:42:59 PM
Come on chaps, poor guy needs a break - turns the game on its head with a class hat-trick and silenced the cut-throat peasants. Top night's work. He is a brilliant player and a real leader, we should reward his loyalty with some of our own and give him his dues now and again. Was startled at how much stick Carra was getting from the guys near me in the Kop - but then he was destroyed in the move for their goal. I thought Gerrard and Mereiles were starting to gel well too.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Tes on November 06, 2010, 01:21:44 AM
(though I was blown away by Lucas's tackle, to set up the third!)

As was the player he took out with it. Good Lucas, prove 'em wrong, my son.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 06, 2010, 01:31:57 AM
Lucas fancied it.

Thought their keeper tho was a big pussy for that first goal.

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Ed on November 06, 2010, 04:26:04 AM
Lucas frustrates me  >:( I like him, but am always wondering if he can just add the one or two things to his game that would mean I didn't have to worry or have my doubts about him. Don't know if it will ever happen but I haven't given up hope...I think one of the things I'm waiting for is... Lucas receives the ball, turns faces forward, beats the first player to challenge him, takes another touch (maybe a bit of a dribble, draw another player to him to create space ahead of him) and then plays a killer pass (low on the ground) that releases an attacker in space and creates an opportunity....... currently, I think he's still a bit too static on the ball and the passing is too patient, conservative and to the feet of the player....
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Clem on November 06, 2010, 08:35:50 AM
Lucas frustrates me  >:( I like him, but am always wondering if he can just add the one or two things to his game that would mean I didn't have to worry or have my doubts about him. Don't know if it will ever happen but I haven't given up hope...I think one of the things I'm waiting for is... Lucas receives the ball, turns faces forward, beats the first player to challenge him, takes another touch (maybe a bit of a dribble, draw another player to him to create space ahead of him) and then plays a killer pass (low on the ground) that releases an attacker in space and creates an opportunity....... currently, I think he's still a bit too static on the ball and the passing is too patient, conservative and to the feet of the player....

well said Ed. Thing is, he has a big heart and tries and we like him for that. He's a true red in spirit. Problem is, he's slow footballer - he passes and he moves slowly, and like Poulson, the one thing that can't be done is make a slow player faster. Lucas needs to get his head up and start thinking about the bigger picture on the pitch, look for a pass rather than react to opponent's pressure or the first available red shirt to offer, otherwise his passing will remain ponderous and he will continue to anchor us. He came as a box-to-box cm, maybe Roy should give him a couple behind Torres and see what happens?
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Juan on November 06, 2010, 11:28:27 AM
There is no questioning Lucas's commitment to the team and club.

But hes here now about 3 full seasons, hes had plenty of games and I think the fact that his ability is still being questioned says it all. Hes a great player to have as back up but unless theres a huge improvement in his game I think he will never be any better than 4th or 5th choice centre mid.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 06, 2010, 03:25:15 PM
re Lucas, I like the lad.

He has been through a culdron of abuse from some quarters in our fanbase and still was mentally strong enough to survive.

He needs more opportunity.  I'd play him further forward. 
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Tes on November 06, 2010, 07:22:30 PM
Play him in the position he played for Gremio and he'll be a different player. His (and any player's) ability to release the ball quickly (or not) will always be governed by the options his team mates give him and the quality of movement around him. May Lucas' apparent hesitancy in releasing the ball says as much about his team mates as it does him.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 09, 2010, 11:26:05 AM


http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/why-stevie-s-our-best-ever

'Why Stevie's our best ever'

John Aldridge has thrown his support behind Jamie Carragher's claim that Steven Gerrard is Liverpool’s greatest player of all-time.

The former Reds striker feels the skipper's ability to turn high profile games on a regular basis stands him out above anybody - even the great Kenny Dalglish.

"It's been a typical kind of week for Steven Gerrard," said Aldridge.

"He led his side to a hugely influential victory at Bolton, came off the bench and scored a hat-trick against the fourth best team in Serie A, then produced another outstanding display against the league leaders.

"But then I wouldn't expect anything less from Stevie, because like Jamie Carragher I believe Steven Gerrard is the greatest player to have ever pulled on the red shirt.

"Now you'd expect Jamie to say that. He's Stevie's team-mate and pal after all.

"But I had the good fortune to play alongside the phenomenal Kenny Dalglish, and I believe Stevie has probably surpassed even King Kenny.

"People say that Stevie can't be considered the best of all time until he's won a league title.

"But he's inspired Liverpool to almost every other trophy - I'm thinking of his Istanbul heroics, his incredible FA Cup final display and his goals in League and UEFA Cup finals."

In recent years Gerrard has helped to terrorise defences playing in a role just behind Fernando Torres.

However, Aldridge reckons his display at the heart of the midfield against Chelsea illustrates that he can make an even greater impact when he starts in the centre of the park.

"He can help the team in a wide variety of positions, but for me the position where he is most effective is where he is now," said Aldo.

"I think Stevie can have the biggest influence on a match from central midfield.

"I particularly liked the way the team was set up against Chelsea on Sunday, with Dirk Kuyt in behind Torres.

"I'd also like to see Glen Johnson come back in on the right of midfield, similar to the way Spurs use Gareth Bale and Everton are currently usuing Seamus Coleman - a youngster who I think can be a great player for Ireland in the future.

"Lucas received plenty of praise for his performance on Sunday.

"If the Brazilian continues the way he played on Sunday he could go on to become a valuable squad player for us.

"But there's no doubt who has been the most valuable player for Liverpool Football Club over the last 12 years.

"For me, Steven Gerrard is the most influential player EVER to have played for The Reds."

Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Kopite999 on November 09, 2010, 11:31:55 AM

Fans pay Stevie tributes

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/video/Features/Fans-pay-Stevie-22232.php3
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 11, 2010, 12:51:50 AM
wigan, what a midfield.  They nullified our superstar. 



Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 14, 2010, 09:02:04 AM
wigan, what a midfield.  They nullified our superstar.

stoke, what a midfield.  They nullified our superstar. 
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Tes on November 14, 2010, 09:11:15 AM
Dude pokes the wasp's nest once more.  ;D
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Redman on November 14, 2010, 09:13:20 AM
Well I'm sitting on the fence in this one. Stevie G our greatest EVER player, no chance, he'd probably just make it into my top 10. On the other hand I have to agree with the comments about him being our best player over the last 10 years or so, he's ploughing a lone furrow out there many a time and I actually feel sorry for the guy. If he had a couple more Carra's, Torreses, Reina's and Alonso types out there he would feel like he doesn't need to do it all. Look what happened when Alonso was there, Stevie pushed further up the field and supported Torres, it's no coincidence that we finished 2nd just 2 seasons ago 4 points off winning the league, the loss of Alonso last season when we finished 7th is hugely underestimated, it's the one thing I can never forgive Rafa for, trying to get Barry to replace Alonso, was he mad? The comparison was Hulahoop getting Diouf when he had the chance to buy Anelka, unforgivable. Oh well rant over.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 14, 2010, 09:25:21 AM
Dude pokes the wasp's nest once more.  ;D

you have to agree tho, it makes the forum a tad more colourful   :D
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 14, 2010, 09:34:25 AM
the one thing I can never forgive Rafa for, trying to get Barry to replace Alonso, was he mad? The comparison was Hulahoop getting Diouf when he had the chance to buy Anelka, unforgivable. Oh well rant over.

agreed.......tho rafa did have fair reasons (alonso had been playing poorly).

But Rafa's religion was football....and personal relationships came a distant second.

As for captain marvel....let's put it this way, there are others very/more deserving of some top scale recognition.

e.g. didi hamann (didi was the key to houllier being eliminated, by bayer leverkusen, from the CL......the worst Liverpool substitution in my lifetime), and Rafa winning it, in 2005.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: Redman on November 14, 2010, 10:05:25 AM

e.g. didi hamann (didi was the key to houllier being eliminated, by bayer leverkusen, from the CL......the worst Liverpool substitution in my lifetime), and Rafa winning it, in 2005.

Oh that was an awful substitution and I have to keep reminding Pope Pumparse about that when he bangs on about Rafa having to use Didi in the 2nd half of the CL Final in 2005 to track and nullify Kaka, mind you we both know what a hypocrite Pope is. He now supports Roy whole heartedly, the man can do no wrong in his eyes but what do you expect when he wanted Rafa out from day 1.
Title: Re: Steven Gerrard
Post by: the dude abides on November 14, 2010, 10:15:40 AM
Oh that was an awful substitution and I have to keep reminding Pope Pumpa*se about that when he bangs on about Rafa having to use Didi in the 2nd half of the CL Final in 2005 to track and nullify Kaka, mind you we both know what a hypocrite Pope is. He now supports Roy whole heartedly, the man can do no wrong in his eyes but what do you expect when he wanted Rafa out from day 1.

 ;D

I re-installed my old fave xnews program this week..........the software that I used when posting in newsgroups.

I looked in all my old favourite music newsgroups, to see who was still around.  I have yet to look in the Liverpool group.

Pope will always try to be contradictory.........he has long since lost the ability to be sane or truthful.