Anfield Road - Liverpool FC Forum

Football and lesser sports => Liverpool FC, football, sport => Topic started by: Tes on September 06, 2017, 02:15:29 PM

Title: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on September 06, 2017, 02:15:29 PM
Liverpool's contract talks with Emre Can show the ongoing power struggle between players and clubs - there is more on the line for Jurgen Klopp than just the midfielder's Anfield future

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-4857426/Liverpool-s-Emre-talks-player-v-club-power-battle.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-4857426/Liverpool-s-Emre-talks-player-v-club-power-battle.html)

"With only 10 months left on his deal the sticking point is not over money, but a release clause. "


Offer him a lower salary with a £50M clause in, or a higher salary with a £75M clause.

The player gets to choose - easier exit and lower income, or harder exit but higher income.

The player has some sort of window to leave, whilst the club protects it's investment made in the player.

Apparently he's only on something like £35K a week (not sure how true that is, only what I've read), so £75K and a £50M clause, or £100K with a £75M clause, meaning if we're to get less for him, he gets less in wages, or if we're to get more for him, he gets more in wages.
He shares in our increased fee, likewise, he receives less if we're to have to receive less.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on September 06, 2017, 05:50:24 PM
Also, any release clause shouldn't kick in until Summer 2019, meaning we know we have him for this and next season, and it lapses on 1st August 2019, so that we would have time to replace him during the Summer of 2019.

He could have one which could be triggered next Summer, but at 50% higher. Also, the clauses can only be triggered in Summer windows, not January ones.

Clauses can work both ways.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on September 13, 2017, 07:12:32 PM
We seem to be heavily linked with Stefan De Vrij at the moment, either a January move, or potentially a free transfer next Summer.

Why? We already have enough problems with the amount of games Matip and Lovren miss through injury, and De Vrij's injury record doesn't read like the improvement we need:

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/stefan-de-vrij/verletzungen/spieler/111196 (https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/stefan-de-vrij/verletzungen/spieler/111196)

Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on September 13, 2017, 10:09:55 PM
we need Rafa Benitez.

Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on September 18, 2017, 12:13:32 PM
Klopp considers Sturridge sale after setting striker ultimatum

http://www.teamtalk.com/news/klopp-considers-sturridge-sale-after-setting-striker-ultimatum (http://www.teamtalk.com/news/klopp-considers-sturridge-sale-after-setting-striker-ultimatum)


I doubt this would be true, but strikers, probably more than any other player, need games to develop and keep their rhythm. Sturridge not getting that, just getting the odd start and a few minutes from the bench here and there, is not helping him, and are we really set up to get the best out of him. Conversely, is his style suited to ours anymore?
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on September 20, 2017, 10:08:37 PM
We seem to be heavily linked with Stefan De Vrij at the moment, either a January move, or potentially a free transfer next Summer.

Why? We already have enough problems with the amount of games Matip and Lovren miss through injury, and De Vrij's injury record doesn't read like the improvement we need:

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/stefan-de-vrij/verletzungen/spieler/111196 (https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/stefan-de-vrij/verletzungen/spieler/111196)

Liverpool and Juventus target scores first goal of the season to give Lazio the lead

http://www.calciomercato.com/en/news/liverpool-and-juventus-target-scores-first-goal-of-the-season-to-52911 (http://www.calciomercato.com/en/news/liverpool-and-juventus-target-scores-first-goal-of-the-season-to-52911)

"Lazio, however, are now 3-1 down. De Vrij did non start the second half due to an injury."  ;D  ;D
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on September 25, 2017, 12:31:15 PM
The Catalan press have started again, saying that we're going to let Coutinho go in January, he's asked to go in January and even FSG have started talks:

http://www.caughtoffside.com/2017/09/25/barcelona-refuse-to-give-up-on-114m-target-lfc-now-willing-to-talk/ (http://www.caughtoffside.com/2017/09/25/barcelona-refuse-to-give-up-on-114m-target-lfc-now-willing-to-talk/)

http://metro.co.uk/2017/09/25/liverpool-open-to-letting-philippe-coutinho-join-barcelona-in-january-transfer-6953777/ (http://metro.co.uk/2017/09/25/liverpool-open-to-letting-philippe-coutinho-join-barcelona-in-january-transfer-6953777/)

http://sportwitness.co.uk/fsg-going-transfer-talks-enthusiastically-jurgen-klopp-commitment/ (http://sportwitness.co.uk/fsg-going-transfer-talks-enthusiastically-jurgen-klopp-commitment/)

HA!!!!
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on September 25, 2017, 03:36:53 PM
From: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/liverpool-target-another-two-defenders-while-tottenham-could-land-real-madrid-man-in-swap-deal-transfer-rumours-36165953.html (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/liverpool-target-another-two-defenders-while-tottenham-could-land-real-madrid-man-in-swap-deal-transfer-rumours-36165953.html)

"Arsenal are interested in Le Havre defender HAROLD MOUKOUDI - but face competition from Nice, Bordeaux and Red Bull Leipzig. It's reported that the Gunners have their eye on the 19-year-old, seen as an up-and-coming star in the French youth football."


Considering that Nice, and even more so, Red Bull Leipzig have a top class record of unearthing real quality players for not lot of money, then maybe we should be in on this piece of action. I'd trust any number of clubs' scouting before I'd place any faith in our's.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on October 04, 2017, 12:35:57 PM
I see in today's media that Countinhio still wants to leave for Barca.....and that he apparently speaks regularly with Barca people. 

Not surprised.    He has looked different since the summer.  His heart doesn't seem at Liverpool.

But hey - 200 million and he's yours - tis my attitude. 
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on October 04, 2017, 07:11:38 PM
I see in today's media that Countinho still wants to leave for Barca.....and that he apparently speaks regularly with Barca people. 

Not surprised.    He has looked different since the summer.  His heart doesn't seem at Liverpool.

But hey - 200 million and he's yours - tis my attitude.

The Catalans won't get their freedom from Spain, so they're supposedly still on the hunt for Coutinho, though this is all according to the Catalan press. I wouldn't be surprised to see him go though, as there seems to be a general malaise setting in again at the club.
The problems aren't just on the pitch or in the manager's office. The whole setup is wrong. Until that changes, and we all know those I'm referring to, then all we will ever do is splutter along.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on October 05, 2017, 11:34:46 AM
this is all according to the Catalan press. I wouldn't be surprised to see him go though, as there seems to be a general malaise setting in again at the club.
The problems aren't just on the pitch or in the manager's office. The whole setup is wrong. Until that changes, and we all know those I'm referring to, then all we will ever do is splutter along.

good point - the media there were spinning yarns all summer.  It' hard to know when to believe them.

yes....our entire setup is wrong.  Klopp and balance are like oil and water.

breaks my heart that Rafa is not at Anfield.  I am still very annoyed at those who sacked him.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on October 05, 2017, 05:22:44 PM
Whether one of them is Van Dijk, or not, we need to target two centre halves, and a midfielder than is capable of giving proper protection to the two centre halves.

To be saying we need to target two centre halves and a defensively capable midfielder in the January transfer window, just goes to show what a dog's breakfast we made of the Summer window.

It's not just personnel though, it's structural aspects of the way we play that need altering too.

The structural part can be done without a single signing. You can't have both fullbacks going forward, and the midfield two pushing on also, basically leaving the centre halves on their own at the point at which possession changes hands. Surely there's a defensively savvy midfielder that can play a ten/fifteen yard pass to a team mate successfully, out there somewhere to buy.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on October 25, 2017, 05:21:21 PM
Liverpool news: Jurgen Klopp must NOT be trusted to buy players in January - Steve Nicol

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/871032/Liverpool-news-Jurgen-Klopp-transfer-gossip (http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/871032/Liverpool-news-Jurgen-Klopp-transfer-gossip)

So Mr Nicol, who do you suggest? Michael Edwards? Barry Hunter? Dave Fallows? Aka the transfer committee, minus of course, Brendan and 'Harley' Ayre.

Herein lies the crux of the problem we've been talking about since Rodgers' second Summer.

The entire recruitment process, and by extension, whoever is therefore involved, is simply not fit for purpose. In fact our defence is more fit for it's supposed purpose.

Our recruitment has been poor by and large across the last two managers with the common thread being Edwards, Fallows and Hunter.

Dortmund's recruitment has been praised during the Klopp era, continued with Tuchul and has hardly been lambasted now Peter Bosz is at the helm. The common thread across all that time - Michael Zorc.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on November 18, 2017, 07:53:32 PM
Surely after today's performance, and his season so far, Van Dijk's fee is now no more that £35M/£40M.  ;D

Do we splurge £60M/£70M (supposedly) on Van Dijk, or do we look to buy a 'partnership' for that money?

It's going to be harder in January getting quality, but if there is an option available that would upgrade on Klavan (arguably Lovren also as there's little to choose between them so far this season), do we do that?
Strengthening the squad is exactly that, even if it's an upgrade on our third best centre half - I'm not placing Gomez in any centre half pecking order as he hasn't really been seen there for us, and his performance for England in 'a three' is arguably different to what would be required in a traditional centre back 'partnership', so I'm not considering that.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Edward224 on November 20, 2017, 06:14:29 PM
We won't sign anyone in January and Ings and Sturridge will both leave. One on loan and one permanently.

We may sign an under 18 player...........but no first team players. Also City will sign Van Dijk.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on November 23, 2017, 09:52:44 PM
We won't sign anyone in January and Ings and Sturridge will both leave. One on loan and one permanently.

We may sign an under 18 player...........but no first team players. Also City will sign Van Dijk.

That's cheered me up no end. Thanks.  ;D

So at who's door are laying what you say? Klopp's or FSG's?
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Edward224 on November 26, 2017, 04:58:59 PM
That's cheered me up no end. Thanks.  ;D

So at who's door are laying what you say? Klopp's or FSG's?

Just to add that is only my opinion!!

It's at FSG's door totally if they don't get the players Jurgen wants

In the summer he wanted Van Dijk, Keita and Salah. He's got two of those, well one for this season. But the players he is targeting for me are the right players.

I don't know why we signed Robertson if Jurgen will never use him and same goes for other signings we hardly use.




Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on November 27, 2017, 05:09:34 PM
I don't know why we signed Robertson if Jurgen will never use him and same goes for other signings we hardly use.

This one seems the most odd. Was Robertson foisted on him by Edwards? Klopp doesn't seem convinced by him. He's barely what you'd even call a squad player.

The whole thing reeks of 'amateur hour' once again.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 10, 2017, 11:13:18 PM
Yet again we're being linked with Aubameyang, however with Peter Bosz being sacked as manager, Aubameyang's desire to leave may change again, but it seems the theme of this window's rampant speculation seems to be Coutinho and Sturridge out, Aubameyang in.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Edward224 on December 19, 2017, 10:14:21 PM
We don't really need Aubameyang in truth. We need someone who can replace Firmino as the false 9 with a back up number 9 when we need a focal point. Which I think is why Sturridge - if he is happy - would still be ok with me. But if he wants to go then I would prefer to spend the cash on another false 9 as even though I would prefer to spend heavy on a top class striker, it wouldn't fit Klopp's system.

Plus Klopp and Aubameyang did not get on.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 20, 2017, 11:40:41 AM
We don't really need Aubameyang in truth. We need someone who can replace Firmino as the false 9 with a back up number 9 when we need a focal point. Which I think is why Sturridge - if he is happy - would still be ok with me. But if he wants to go then I would prefer to spend the cash on another false 9 as even though I would prefer to spend heavy on a top class striker, it wouldn't fit Klopp's system.

Plus Klopp and Aubameyang did not get on.

This is why I don't get why we get linked with the likes of Aubameyang, or why pundits say we need a top class 'centre forward'. Why buy a square peg when our hole is round? Having an 'option' is a different matter, and surely not something you spend in excess of £50M on.

Would the system work any better with a typical no9? Doubtful, unless it was altered radically to allow a no9 to be incorporated into it.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 20, 2017, 11:49:08 AM
The whole Coutinho thing has erupted again. Apparently we've agreed €150M with the Catalans. Of course a they expect us to receive a big chunk of it in add-ons and the cheeky gits want to pay the 'assured' part in installments.

The news must be on a slow day in Catalonia again.

Of course we're flattered and honoured that such a beeeg club like Barca want to buy our best player, and in the middle of the season too. They can tell us the price they want to pay, how much of it is only a probability, how they want to pay the definite part, and the price is in their currency, not ours.  ;D

Try again.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 23, 2017, 10:41:48 PM
Of course we need a centre half, a new goal keeper wouldn't be a profligate outlay either, and a defensive midfield option could be more than useful too, but the thing we lack the most is a leader.

We desperately need someone who can calm things down, stop the instant sagging of spirits and make sure heads aren't lost. Someone who can quickly quell any slipping away of confidence and get things quickly sorted and stabilised when we lose a goal, so the normal avalanche doesn't get under way.

Whether that's a centre half or a midfielder, it makes no odds. It just needs to happen.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 27, 2017, 12:03:22 PM
Liverpool transfer news: Juventus make contact with Emre Can over January swoop

https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/896931/Liverpool-transfer-news-Juventus-Emre-Can-Jurgen-Klopp-gossip-rumours-contract (https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/896931/Liverpool-transfer-news-Juventus-Emre-Can-Jurgen-Klopp-gossip-rumours-contract)


Let him go. Contrast the improvement and change in Oxlade-Chamberlain to Can. Can looks like a player who's always content with his performance and thinks he's far better than he is.

He's one of the players you thought would improve greatly under Klopp, but it just isn't happening.

Whatever he's asking for with his new contract, he just isn't worth. If he thinks he's going to get £100K+ a week at Juve, then he's deluded. I'd be surprised if he gets much more than he's on now.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 27, 2017, 06:33:46 PM
Liverpool confirm world-record £75m deal for Virgil van Dijk

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/12/27/liverpool-agree-world-record-75m-deal-virgil-van-dijk/ (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/12/27/liverpool-agree-world-record-75m-deal-virgil-van-dijk/)


Insanity!!!!

Having been injured for the 2nd half of last season, he's not been the same player since returning to the team.
If that's down to his failed Summer transfer, you only have to look at Coutinho to see the right attitude. Maybe it's down to his injury. Either way, £75M is crass stupidity. A 25% increase on the rumoured amount we were prepared to pay in the Summer. Where's that come from?

Do we even know how to negotiate? Or what the word even means?

Surely we could buy a central defensive partnership for that, and whilst either may not be quite as good individually as Van Dijk, as a partnership, they'll be better than the resulting combination of whichever one of our poor centre halves Van Dijk gets lumbered partnered with.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 27, 2017, 06:49:09 PM
I hope Southampton have 'given us permission' to announce the signing.  ;D

If so, I wonder how much we paid for the privilege.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 29, 2017, 12:06:18 AM
Have we missed a trick with Toby Alderweireld, or could we still pull it off?

Apparently his contract runs to July 2019, with Spurs having the option of extending it for a further 12 months. However, there's supposedly a clause that states he will then have a release clause of £25M in the Summer following or that Summer (if triggered in the Summer) in which Spurs trigger the extension.

So if they were to try and trigger the extension to 2020 now, he could be bought for £25M in the Summer.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 29, 2017, 12:11:06 AM
Exclusive: Southampton keen on Daniel Sturridge and ready to make audacious bid for Fulham's Ryan Sessegnon

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/12/28/southampton-keen-daniel-sturridge-ready-make-audacious-move/ (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/12/28/southampton-keen-daniel-sturridge-ready-make-audacious-move/)

Considering how much we've been stung for by Southampton over the last few seasons, then a £15M loan fee seems reasonable.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on December 29, 2017, 12:17:41 AM
Inigo Martinez of Real Sociedad apparently has a release clause of £28M in his contract. Maybe that's worth a punt to give Van Dijk a new partner, considering how poor Matip's been this season, and his injury record.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 02, 2018, 06:12:53 PM
Massimiliano Allegri's answer, when asked about signing Can this month, is priceless:

It is important not to lower the quality of the team and remain focused on our targets.

So Can is only seen as worth having as a squad player, and because he's free. If he thinks he's going to get £100k a week at Juve then he's in La La land.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on January 03, 2018, 12:26:02 AM
agreed.

the big money is in england.   There is only sun, and a slower pace of league in Italy (which may suit his lazy slow to football).

I would not be surprised if he ends up signing a new contract with Liverpool.  It just feels like he is playing the field.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on January 03, 2018, 12:39:10 AM
Coutinho

Guillam Balague writes on Twitter: “About Coutinho. Barcelona will soon make an offer of €110+40.
“Chairman Bartomeu feels in debt to him for how hard he's trying to go to FCB.
“Their top players want him.
“LFC have changed their tone but have not put price to him.
“They will act when offer arrives. Which it will.”


I always respect Ballague and his sources.  Sounds like 150 might be enough.....tho I imagine depends upon how much up front and how much is addons. 

I'd suggest 150 upfront and no addons.  The guy is not 19 years old - he is bloddy mid-20s and a well-established regular in Brazil's front line.
To be honest, I can't figure why Coutinho leaving mid-season can be any good for the player, Liverpool or Barca.  He can have a go at the Champions League with Liverpool....and is cup-tied for Barca.  And Barca lead the Liga by some distance.  Leaving now, is a lose lose for the lad, and Liverpool.
I see mutterings too, of us trying to bring forward Keita's arrival from Leipzig, to January.















Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 05, 2018, 12:22:54 PM
Coutinho

Guillam Balague writes on Twitter: “About Coutinho. Barcelona will soon make an offer of €110+40.
“Chairman Bartomeu feels in debt to him for how hard he's trying to go to FCB.
“Their top players want him.
“LFC have changed their tone but have not put price to him.
“They will act when offer arrives. Which it will.”


I always respect Ballague and his sources.  Sounds like 150 might be enough.....tho I imagine depends upon how much up front and how much is addons. 

I'd suggest 150 upfront and no addons.  The guy is not 19 years old - he is bloddy mid-20s and a well-established regular in Brazil's front line.
To be honest, I can't figure why Coutinho leaving mid-season can be any good for the player, Liverpool or Barca.  He can have a go at the Champions League with Liverpool....and is cup-tied for Barca.  And Barca lead the Liga by some distance.  Leaving now, is a lose lose for the lad, and Liverpool.
I see mutterings too, of us trying to bring forward Keita's arrival from Leipzig, to January.

I think Coutinho is worried that if he doesn't move in this window then his ship will have sailed come the Summer. From a footballing perspective, he has no chance of playing for Barca in the CL, so whilst they have more chance of winning it than us, it would be an empty victory for Coutinho, where as with us, he'd have the whole experience, medal etc.
Also, he's a guaranteed starter, bang in form and will walk into Brazil's starting eleven at the World Cup in the Summer, if he stays with us. Can the same be said if he moves to Barca?

I can understand him, especially as a South American player, wanting to play for Barca, and who wouldn't want a chance to play with Messi. As Messi is now 30, how long has he got left at the peak of his powers? 
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 05, 2018, 12:35:31 PM
Apparently Can has signed a 5 year deal, worth £85k a week, with Juve.

I wonder if there's a release clause in that contract. Doubtful.

I'm sure we would have been fine paying him £85k, especially as Lovren is supposedly on £100k.

However, the fact he wants/wanted a release clause in our contract, hardly shows a player committed to us for the long term.

He should have been sold in Summer 2016, or last Summer. He's hardly an indispensable part of the team, and the fact that clubs are only now interested in him on a free, not even with just a year on his contract, hardly marks him out as an 'important' player for whichever team he goes to.

Can on a free, to add to the squad would be an appealing prospect for us. Would we really pay £50M to buy him? It's doubtful.

To me he's no great loss. For every great game he plays for us, there's 4 or 5 mediocre ones.

I'd rather see him left out now and play someone else. Grujic maybe. Give the shirt to players who will be here into the future. Develop the team with players that can be a part of it next season, and beyond.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 05, 2018, 12:54:56 PM
agreed.

the big money is in england.   There is only sun, and a slower pace of league in Italy (which may suit his lazy slow to football).

I would not be surprised if he ends up signing a new contract with Liverpool.  It just feels like he is playing the field.

Can would be far better suited to Italian football. Everything about him, and everything he seems to do, just appears to be in slow motion.
Slow over the ground with or without the ball, quits tracking back once he reaches the edge of the area, slow decision making, and multiple touches.

He's a 'betwixt and between' sort of midfielder. Not one particular type or another, and not a particularly accomplished 'all round' midfielder either. We have too many of them as it is.   
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 05, 2018, 04:31:08 PM
We need to make a stand against the ridiculous add-on disease that has now infected transfers.

I could understand 10% of a fee, especially if it was inflated to begin with, being payable only under certain conditions.

The likes of Barcelona are now taking the p!ss where add-ons are concerned.

If they want to try and take our best player with a deal that includes add-ons then the 'base' fee needs to be at least £125M, with add-ons being such as a further £5M each time Barca wins the league, £10M if they win the CL, £5M once Coutinho has earned 10 more Brazilian caps, £5M for every 20 goals he scores for Barca, and a percentage of any fee Barca sell him for - not a percentage of anything over what they bought him from us for, but, for example, 15% of any future fee, so if he was sold for £25M, we would receive £3.75M. 

After all, they got the full fee for Neymar, and don't have to wait for add-ons or installments.

We also need to demand at least 2/3 of the 'base' fee up front, now, with the other 1/3 payable in 12 months time, with add-ons payable within 90 days.

They need to be made to put their cheque book where their mouth is.

I also think it's about time we started putting huge buyout clauses in certain players' contracts. For example Mane and Salah would be good examples. You'd probably not need to do the same for the likes of Klavan or Wijnaldum etc.
If we're forced to agree a sell-on clause with a team we buy from, then it would be a good idea also to put a buy-out fee, or at least a fee 'floor', so we could protect ourselves from losing out on too much in a future sale. Of course we can decide to sell for less than the 'floor' if it was in our interest to 'offload' the player.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 05, 2018, 04:44:50 PM
I'd much rather see us sign Draxler than Lemar, at this point in their careers.

Mahrez might make more sense too than Lemar, being Premier League proven and starting to look like getting back to his best, where as Lemar's form has dropped right off. I'm not saying he's a one season wonder, and the loss of a number of class players from Monaco can't have helped him, but his not stepped up as you'd expect this season.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 07, 2018, 12:29:55 PM
So he's gone. Huge positive nett spend window for FSG. Everyone's happy. Everyone that counts in modern football, that is.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 07, 2018, 01:12:47 PM
I hope we don't make the mistake of trying to replace Coutinho with a supposed 'like for like' player.

Removing the need for so many goals to be scored, would be a help.

Getting both Salah and Mane to get their heads up, and square the ball at times to a better placed team mate, would see goals and assists increase.

The last three games, where we've only conceded the single goal, shows the real way forward. We've scored plenty of twos and threes with Coutinho in the team, yet failed to win a lot of those games.

We need to bring in more creativity from midfield - Can, Hendo, Wijnaldum, the real midfield offers insufficient creativity. We need Lallana back up to speed asap.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on January 07, 2018, 03:13:33 PM
poor form losing him in January.  I think that says something about the player and his loyalties.

Big money move.   I hope we use it wisely - and not be a dummy like when we sold Torres for big money, and burnt our dosh on Andy Bloddy Carroll.

I imagine letting Phil go in this window, must mean we have someone immediately lined up to come in.   Though knowing Klopp... if needs be, he will wait for his target to become available, rather than rushing a sale for a lesser player.

IMHO Barca have bought the wrong red.  Salah is a much better player IMHO.  I'd be worried that Madrid come in for him this summer or next.

Just imagine how good Salah will be at Anfield once he gets settled in!!!   Traditionally, a player peaks after two or three years in the premiership.

I'd like us to bring in Jasper Schmeical from Leicester.  Very good keeper, knows the league, strong reassuring presence at the back, good distribution, great stopper.   I also like his colleague Mahrez.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 07, 2018, 04:08:07 PM
poor form losing him in January.  I think that says something about the player and his loyalties.

Big money move.   I hope we use it wisely - and not be a dummy like when we sold Torres for big money, and burnt our dosh on Andy Bloddy Carroll.

I imagine letting Phil go in this window, must mean we have someone immediately lined up to come in.   Though knowing Klopp... if needs be, he will wait for his target to become available, rather than rushing a sale for a lesser player.

IMHO Barca have bought the wrong red.  Salah is a much better player IMHO.  I'd be worried that Madrid come in for him this summer or next.

Just imagine how good Salah will be at Anfield once he gets settled in!!!   Traditionally, a player peaks after two or three years in the premiership.

I'd like us to bring in Jasper Schmeical from Leicester.  Very good keeper, knows the league, strong reassuring presence at the back, good distribution, great stopper.   I also like his colleague Mahrez.

I'd be more surprised to see us 'replace' Coutinho in this window. The whole approach from us seemed different to the Summer, and it wouldn't surprise me if there was an agreement in the Summer that if Barca offer a better deal in January, which is to our liking, then we'd let him go.

I think Klopp understands that you don't necessarily replace 'certain' players, you replace or improve on 'their effect'. A tighter defence lessens the need for Coutinho's goals and assists to be replaced in order to win matches etc.

Only when Coutinho didn't play in the front three does our midfield have real 'creativity', especially if Lallana is missing. Even then, it's been more a front four rather than Coutinho really playing in midfield.

Improving the pace, dynamism and 'real' creativity (Lallana aside) of our midfield (Can, Hendo, Wijnaldum) would help hugely.
Mane now gets the chance to play most games and rediscover his top form, and as Lallana's fitness and match touch comes back, we have two things to help fill the gap in a slightly different way.
Oxlade-Chamberlain is gradually have more impact, and as that develops, it will bring something additional.

Coutinho's a pretty unique player, hence Barca wanting him above others. We can adapt and develop, rather than try to replicate. After all, how many trophies did the 'collective' win with Coutinho in it?
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on January 07, 2018, 07:15:35 PM
I think Klopp understands that you don't necessarily replace 'certain' players, you replace or improve on 'their effect'.

Only when Coutinho didn't play in the front three does our midfield have real 'creativity', especially if Lallana is missing. Even then, it's been more a front four rather than Coutinho really playing in midfield.

Improving the pace, dynamism and 'real' creativity (Lallana aside) of our midfield (Can, Hendo, Wijnaldum) would help hugely.

Mane now gets the chance to play most games and rediscover his top form, and as Lallana's fitness and match touch comes back, we have two things to help fill the gap in a slightly different way.
Oxlade-Chamberlain is gradually have more impact, and as that develops, it will bring something additional.

Coutinho's a pretty unique player, hence Barca wanting him above others. We can adapt and develop, rather than try to replicate. After all, how many trophies did the 'collective' win with Coutinho in it?

that final point, is something that I have been thinking about too.

How often has Phil ever even looked like leading us to a league title, or a cup.

Suarez was the guy who nearly hauled us to the title a few years back.  But Phil has never been in that class.

I will always remember him scoring a great dinked goal at Old Trafford the other season, to put the UEFA Cup two-legged tie to bed just before half time.  That will be my favourite moment of Phil's......as well as his great free-kicks.

As you say, it's not a case of replacing like-with-like.  Every player brings their own attributes and personality to a team. 

Like you, I would like to see creativity added to our midfield.  And also a holding midfielder too, to protect the defence......not forgetting a new keeper.

Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 08, 2018, 06:47:34 AM
From:

Emre Can to stay at Liverpool in January but 'very close' to signing Juventus deal

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/672275/Liverpool-news-Emre-Can-Juventus-transfer-news (https://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/672275/Liverpool-news-Emre-Can-Juventus-transfer-news)


Juventus boss Massimiliano Allegri admitted last week that he's a big fan of the German midfielder.

"We're all aware of Emre Can's qualities," he said.



Care to enlighten us as to what they are because he keeps them well hidden when he's wearing a red shirt.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 08, 2018, 07:02:00 AM
It will work in our favour if Monaco won't sell Lemar in January.

He's not reached the heights he did last season. I realise he lost a fair few team mates in the Summer, but Monaco are still 2nd in the French league, so they've hardly crumbled.

Losing the likes of M'Bappe should see someone like Lemar step forward and take centre stage in his absence. Truly class players do that.

By waiting until the Summer, we could save ourselves wasting an awful lot of money.

Draxler is the one we should be aiming for. He's a more rounded player, able to play wide or centrally equally as affectively, and he's at the point in his career to take the big step up like Coutinho did over the last 18 months.
His chances of doing that at PSG are limited.

We could also take Kevin Trapp off PSG on loan until the end of the season, as he's a definite step up from Mignolet and Karius, or maybe take advantage of Stoke being managerless and put a bid in for Jack Butland, and see if something shakes loose there.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 08, 2018, 11:10:54 PM
If there's once transfer that will both highlight the madness of the market and the total dearth of centre halves, it will be if Jonny Evans leaves WBA for either Chelsea or Arsenal, for anything over £10M, probably closer to £30M.

Where was the clamour for his signature when Van Gaal sold him for £6M 2 Summers ago?

Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on January 15, 2018, 05:26:07 PM
Reports in Portugal today suggest Liverpool are looking closely at Sporting Lisbon's 22-year-old winger, Gelson Martins. He has a release clause of €60million, but we are looking to pay just half of that amount.....and are willing to offer his a wage fives times what he earns now.

Apparently Martins was a Liverpool transfer target in the summer and at one stage looked to be an alternative to Salah when negotiations with Roma hit a roadblock.

It now appears as though the Portuguese winger wasn’t an alternative to the Egyptian forward but was actually targeted to supplement his arrival.

He has electric pace and a big shot.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 15, 2018, 09:22:38 PM
I watched as much of him as I could in the Euros, as it was just before then we were first linked. He blow hot and cold.
I haven't seen much of him since and his goals/assists haven't moved on hugely. Then again, stats are no recommenders of real talent, or what a player could be capable of in the right environment.

One thing that's becoming so clear is that Klopp only buys a piece of the jigsaw. He doesn't want any one piece to be the bulk of the picture, but 'a part'. The collective will always produce more than any one individual ever could.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on January 16, 2018, 09:51:04 PM
One thing that's becoming so clear is that Klopp only buys a piece of the jigsaw. He doesn't want any one piece to be the bulk of the picture, but 'a part'. The collective will always produce more than any one individual ever could.

yes, unlike Rodgers who brought in the second or third best player, for a specific position.......Klopp clearly will bide his time and wait til the player he wants is available.

I guess the difference is, Klopp's pulling power. 

Rodgers could have waited til the cow's came home, and still wouldn't have attracted top players to Liverpool.

When you bring in temporary make-do's, you then have the problem of moving them on, if/when your main target/upgrade becomes available.

Klopp is a patient man.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 27, 2018, 11:27:10 PM
As we've had since the Summer, at least, to come up with an alternative way forward when Coutinho leaves (it was naive at best, and crass stupidity at worst to think he'd stay through 2 windows), and as our midfield is and has been for a long time, incapable of shielding the back four, to have not identified a midfielder to sort at least one of those issues, is just crazy.

So what if Keita's coming in the Summer. He's only one addition anyway. And what about this season? Do we just write off another season?
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on January 28, 2018, 01:05:54 PM
So what if Keita's coming in the Summer. He's only one addition anyway. And what about this season? Do we just write off another season?

Keita will be a great addition.  But like 95% of Klopp's purchases, he is offensive-minded.

Klopp doesn't do defence.....waste of money....and not sexy. 

I am somewhat surprised he even bothers to use a goalkeeper.

And the two central defenders would look better in clowns' outfits and juggling some balls.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 28, 2018, 05:29:53 PM
Jurgen Klopp expects Emre Can to run down his Liverpool contract

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/11226593/jurgen-klopp-expects-emre-can-to-run-down-his-liverpool-contract (http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/11226593/jurgen-klopp-expects-emre-can-to-run-down-his-liverpool-contract)

I hate to say it, but it is a fact - players are assets. As with all assets they have a financial value.

With the transfer fees having reached even more nonsensical levels than ever before, not losing a player that will need replacing, to a free transfer is even more vital than ever before. Whilst Can personally, at least in my opinion. isn't vital, his position is. We've needed to upgrade him for a while, but to upgrade will always cost additional funds on top of those raised by the sale of either that player, or the player he is replacing as a squad player. Now, with fees so high, it will not only cost us what we could have got for selling him last Summer, but also the entire fee to replace/upgrade him.

And why make him captain? That undermines the position of captain of our club, whether it's for one game or not. A player who refuses to commit, a player who will make sure we don't get a penny in compensation for his loss by way of a transfer fee, so he is the only one to benefit financially, and to the maximum, is not suitable to be be Liverpool FC captain, not even for a single minute.

We also need to remove the forcefield that makes him stop dead at the edge of our penalty area when he does his half hearted impression of tracking back.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 28, 2018, 11:06:50 PM
An excellent point made by Bascombe:

Klopp, by contrast, has declared himself satisfied with his resources. He is astute enough to know this result raises inevitable questioning of his – and it is his – patient transfer policy. Ambitious clubs usually buy from a position of strength. Whatever the circumstances, Liverpool have developed an unhealthy habit of doing the reverse – selling their best players whenever they appear to be doing well.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/01/28/jurgen-klopp-left-baffled-following-liverpools-fa-cup-defeat/ (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/01/28/jurgen-klopp-left-baffled-following-liverpools-fa-cup-defeat/)
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 29, 2018, 10:58:53 PM
So everyone above us, and Arsenal and Spurs are all strengthening their squads, meanwhile we're letting another potential supply of goals, in Sturridge, go out on loan to WBA.

Couldn't we at least try dropping Firmino deeper and playing Sturridge through the middle, and let him concentrate on doing what he's there to do, and that's score goals. We'd still get the work rate from Bobby in a deeper position anyway, and he's more creative and hardworking than any of our bunch of 'meh' midfielders.

So we've basically sold Coutinho to get Van Dijk and Keita.

Who goes next to generate the Summer's transfer budget?

Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on January 30, 2018, 01:37:23 AM
So everyone above us, and Arsenal and Spurs are all strengthening their squads, meanwhile we're letting another potential supply of goals, in Sturridge, go out on loan to WBA.

Couldn't we at least try dropping Firmino deeper and playing Sturridge through the middle, and let him concentrate on doing what he's there to do, and that's score goals. We'd still get the work rate from Bobby in a deeper position anyway, and he's more creative and hardworking than any of our bunch of 'meh' midfielders.

I have to say that I am glad to see Dan gone.  Injury prone, often a yard off the pace, and a one-trick pony in recent years (I can always see him tee-ing up the same shot every opportunity....so predictable).

I agree, we should be playing further back - and thus allowing our attacking speed merchants lots of room to work in.

Suck the opposition out - and sucker punch them.

But NO, Mr Klopp would rather have every red player in the opposition half....and learns nothing, and keeps doing the same flawed plan, game after game, season after season.  Clueless.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 30, 2018, 12:45:16 PM
'Fans care about winning NOT bank balances' - Liverpool owners blasted over January transfer dealings

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/fans-care-winning-not-bank-11937586 (https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/fans-care-winning-not-bank-11937586)

It's not often I'd agree with anything Christian Purslow has to say, but I agree totally with the sentiment, and some of his points.

It was either last Summer or this Summer to let Coutinho go. To let him go mid-season without having players lined up to replace his effect was sheer stupidity. If Keita is seen as a 'replacement' or the start of a slightly different direction of travel as far as our play goes, then either we get in another player to compliment that for the midfield, so that player has a season with us before being combined with Keita, and the change is (partially) enacted this season, or we say to Barca, Coutinho and his representatives that he can go next Summer when we get Keita. If we didn't want to 'force' Coutinho to stay beyond January, then we should have had Keita lined up to come in in January. If that wasn't possible then neither was Coutinho's move. Leipzig held firm with Keita, we should have done the same with Coutinho - I don't like having players at the club against their will, but it's better than totally being without.

When Coutinho was playing in the front three, we essentially had two attackers and one creator. When played as part of the 'midfield' three, we had three attackers and a creator in 'midfield'.
Now we have three attackers, and no creator in midfield. It was great that Coutinho was a chance creator and a goalscorer. We're unlikely to get a player as good that does both, so maybe therefore Klopp should have looked at getting either a creator for the midfield three (it wouldn't have hurt having the addition of Coutinho also in the 'front three') or a goalscoring midfielder, and then looked at playing Salah and Mane as the two attackers (free to roam all across the front line, not just play as more conventional strikers/forwards, and then used Bobby in behind as a creator who would play both in behind Mane and Salah, but also go beyond into a more traditional central striker's position, giving us maximum fluidity and variation in one. Then we have the goalscoring midfielder (ala Lampard) able to link deeper midfield to Bobby and then Mane/Salah, and making later runs into the box, providing goals from midfield for this second half of the season, and helping us undo deep sitting defensive teams without Coutinho's 'eye of a needle' passing.

The £35M/£40M spent on Oxlade-Chamberlain should have gone on the 'partial replacement for' / 'way forward after' Coutinho.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 30, 2018, 11:43:54 PM
How about a cheeky £75M bid for Eriksen tomorrow ahead of Sunday's game? Who knows, Levy may just be tempted.  ;D
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on January 31, 2018, 11:04:12 PM
Markovic has gone on loan to Anderlecht - as any other Liverpool player every had as many loan spells.

Flanagan's gone to Bolton on loan.

Harry Wilson's off to Hull, though he has signed a new contract with us.
Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: the dude abides on February 03, 2018, 09:58:46 AM
It was either last Summer or this Summer to let Coutinho go. To let him go mid-season without having players lined up to replace his effect was sheer stupidity.

looked at playing Salah and Mane as the two attackers (free to roam all across the front line, not just play as more conventional strikers/forwards, and then used Bobby in behind as a creator who would play both in behind Mane and Salah, but also go beyond into a more traditional central striker's position, giving us maximum fluidity

agreed re timing of Coutinho's move.   Clearly he must have been very pizzed to not have got the move last summer - and it was close to downing tools time IMHO  That's what it feels like from the outside looking on.

Re Salah and Mane as our two strikers.  I have been saying the same here since the start of the season - I felt last year, that Mane could be developed into a great striker (just needs more confidence).  And when I saw Salah this season, I felt Mane and Salah could be a modern Toshack/Keegan partnership. 

To me, as much as I love him, Bobby Firmino is not your typical english striker. 


Title: Re: January Transfer Window 2018
Post by: Tes on March 12, 2018, 08:32:23 PM
Barcelona news: Philippe Coutinho causing problems for Ernesto Valverde - report

https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/930750/Barcelona-news-Philippe-Coutinho-causing-problems-Ernesto-Valverde (https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/930750/Barcelona-news-Philippe-Coutinho-causing-problems-Ernesto-Valverde)


"However, it appears his move may be turning sour.

According to Spanish outlet Diario Gol, Coutinho is refusing to change his position from an attacker to a midfield-based outlet.

The 25-year-old has been deployed alongside Lionel Messi and Luis Suarez in attack of late.

But the publication claims Valverde wants Coutinho to fill the hole which will be left when Andres Iniesta calls time on his glittering career.

And the new arrival's reluctance to alter his stance may lead to a change of Barcelona's transfer policy.
"


Well, well. The grass is really greener in Liverpool than in Barcalona.

Sometimes players really don't understand when they are actually well off.

£25M and we'll take him off your hands.