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Messages - Ageing Stick Insect

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Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 17, 2013, 07:14:24 PM »
ASI, we've got an important European tie coming up,
a big test for the manager, 5-0 against a weakened Swansea
will mean little unless he can cross the bridge between
we played well and should have scored but for their
man of the match keeper, the lads gave it everything and
notions of victory in defeat
to the land of getting results in
big games.

I think everyone knows that Ed but it does our aspirations no harm at all to put in a good performance today. Give the man some credit.

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 17, 2013, 06:07:10 PM »
Good result. Swansea rest 7 players though for the Carling Cup next sunday though. So i won't quite start feeling that Rodgers has turned a corner. We can only beat the team infront of us though and we did that capably today.
Very flawed judgement from Laudrup. Why the need to rest 7 players for a game in 7 days against a Championship side?

And very promising home debut from Couthino with a goal. Just need to iron out the inconsistency. Nothing wrong with the way we play when we do it well.

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 17, 2013, 04:43:34 PM »
Interesting. When we're losing the detractors are on here like a shot. Currently 5-0 up and not a whisper. Hmmm.  ::)

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 17, 2013, 10:09:35 AM »
Ray, it's this exact sort of thing that drives me mad with Rodgers. When we go two up there is no apparent aspect to our gameplan to shut up shop and keep that lead. At that point possession becomes an important factor in keeping the lead. You are at your most vulnerable in the first 15 minutes after scoring a goal.
Therefore we have to address that as part of our gameplan.
But possession alone does not provide the answer. For example we could switch to a more definitive 4-2-3-1 or even 4-3-2-1 morphing into 4-2-3-1 5-10 mins after the goal. With 4-3-3, we then keep two in front of the defence and only one fullback attack at a time. Also as the opposition will up their tempo in motivation to equalise, we have to up our tempo in motivation to close down quicker and force them back, not allowing them to build confidence increasing momentum.

As you say Ray it's happened all season with no sign of change or improvement as we've progressed further into and through the season. It's one of the frustrations Swansea fans had last season with Rodgers, so that tells me it's a flaw in his methods and tactics.

He's a young manager, hugely inexperienced as a manager, but who has coached and developed a philosphy that hasn't been put to the test in it's infancy. Therefore the philosophy has grown and developed unchecked until he appears blinded to aspects of it's failings, because he had so long to convinced himself unchecked of it's validity. We tend to be more idealistic in youth, than in seniority, at the beginning rather than after years of experience and practice. He's behaving true to human nature. And there's no-one in any position at the club with the knowledge or presence to 'have a word'.
And so we're back to the ineffectiveness and unsuitability for purpose of the administration from the top down.

Compare who Shankly, Paisley, Fagan, Dalglish had in place at the club to support and back up their efforts, both on the coaching  and administrative side. The differences and downgrade are gaping.

Rodgers needs experienced help and the humility to accept it.

Tes, I'm not sure what to say to all that. Teams will always have goals scored against them when ahead irrespective of the formation. It happened against Arsenal and City but not against several teams home and away. We know Rogers isn't going to turn things around in one season. The man has to be given time. For all we know (and we know almost nothing of what actually goes on inside the club) he may have identified outside help he requires and that may be addressed in the summer.

For now I'm just going to support the manager and team and hope we have a strong end to the season. Who knows what will happen in the summer.

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 16, 2013, 03:17:34 PM »
Sorry for posting a link to a thread in another forum, but that opening post is so brilliant that I had to share with people on here.


Thanks Edward. Brilliant summing up of the last 20 years and now. One thing is for sure. Stupidity and access to the internet have created a new type of fan that just didn't exist 20 years ago.

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 16, 2013, 03:05:42 PM »
Tes, you've embedded your replies into my post so I can't easily quote you.

Yes, the defensive side is a concern but the players and manager should be discussing where the errors are happening and looking to tighten things up. Carragher should be useful here and in a couple of years hopefully our defensive coach.

You make a perfectly valid point that a better defence lesens the chances of defeat. The most frustrating thing for me is being pegged back after we go ahead. It's as if the defence just switch off so I would be looking to address that first. I can't believe no-one is spotting it and we have to hope they have the ability to address it.

That was a bad decision to ignore Sturridge and go for Carroll instead. But I hope Brendan realises that Carroll could still become a valuable team member. After all, we could have lost Henderson and Downing earlier and he now accepts that would have been a mistake. Hopefully he'll change his mind about Andy.

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 16, 2013, 09:46:02 AM »
I understand what you're saying about Sturridge, Ray, but there's more to it than that. 20 times this season we've conceded two or more goals in game. It was a similar pattern at Swansea under Rodgers.
There's an inherent flaw in his method of setting up a team and the way he gets them to play, and that's not down to neither Swansea or us prior to January having Daniel Sturridge on a team sheet.
If so, then it really does highlight the ridiculous decision to forego £40M + Sturridge for Torres and instead blow it Andy Carroll. 

He may well have flaws Tes (as we all have) but he's not a stupid man and he'll learn and adapt. He's had 2 transfer windows to strengthen the side and clearly attack had priority. Come the summer we will get new defenders in and that could make the difference. Or maybe he'll setup the side differently.

I'm in the camp that keeping a clean sheet isn't paramount. You simply have to score more goals than the opposition to get the 3 points. I'd happily concede 3 goals every game if we scored 4.

We shouldn't also forget that we lost a good coach in Steve Clarke and his replacement may not be as good. That should be addressed asap.

The Carroll decision wasn't Rogers'. Can't blame him for that one.

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 15, 2013, 10:56:38 PM »
Less than a week ago national media heaped praise on us for successive and impressive performances against Arsenal and ManC away. 6-7 Days later it's all doom and gloom. We may not be that good, but we're not even half as crap as some make us out to be.

Totally agree with that Martin. And no-one has pointed out one thing common in both the 2-0 defeats. We didn't have Sturridge! I believe that made a huge difference to our setup and performance. All of a sudden we had to revert to the old system and it clearly didn't work. Come Sunday with Sturridge back I think we'll play a lot better. Yes, we may concede but I think we'll win the game.

It's likely we'll go out of the EL next week because Sturridge is ineligible but the damage was done yesterday. Not by our defence but by Suarez who should hang his head in shame for his finishing. probably the worst game he's played for us.

I'm not surprised to read bilge in some papers. They have to fill column inches. We all knew it would be a rocky season. Let's wait and see how it pans out. One thing is for sure. Rogers WILL be manager next season. To sack him would be to bring scorn on the club as the northern Chelsea!

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 11, 2013, 10:07:11 PM »
if I recall correctly, you said exactly the same thing in February last year, re Dalglish. 

I couldn't care less what I allegedly said last year. The owners aren't going to sack someone of their choice after 1 season.

Liverpool FC, football, sport / Re: Season 2012-2013
« on: February 11, 2013, 10:00:29 PM »
Poor performance from the players today. Just not at the races.

Agreed. Even from the start passes were short and no fluency. The harder they tried the worse it got. The way to score from headers is to run in fast. Not from standing still.

Probably down to changed formation without Sturridge. Hopefully back Thursday. Suggestions the manager will depart in the summer are nothing short of stupid.

You're far better than me at being objective about Utd Martin. I've detested the club since 1977 when we suffered a stuffy goal and lost the Cup Final. Ferguson has intensified my detestation. Can't stand him either despite all he's won. I still assert they're average compared to previous Utd sides. But hey, this is the Carragher thread so why are we talking about Manure?

I tend to disagree on ManU, Ray. There was nothing average about their seeing off the Bitter's last nite. That's the level our performances need to reach, i.e., seeing off opponents without exhausting ourselves in the process. To your list of struggling teams I would add Chelsea. It isn't beyond them to miss out on 4th for the 2nd year running. Not likely but hardly on the other side of what's possible.
Martin, It's been mentioned on Match of the Day that Utd really haven't caught fire this season. Their biggest wins have been two 4-0 wins over Wigan. And their goals conceded is 31 - just 1 less than ours. That's what I mean about average or nothing special. A decent side doesn't go a goal down as many times as them.

If this season's anything to go by I'm sure they'll drop points between now and the end of season and most likely in places you didn't expect beforehand. Arsenal was very lucky to get away with 3 points from the Stadium of Light and there's nothing about them that makes me see them as an invincible force. Same with Spurs who also have a very tough fixture list remaining.

Yes, plenty of surprises remaining. Take Bale out of Spurs and they'll struggle. Didn't see the Arsenal game. City are disjointed. Even Manure have been very average this season.

agreed, Ray.

my best guess is

1 - United

2 - City and Chelsea fighting it out for 2nd.

4 - Spurs and Arsenal battling for 4th.

Our best bet is 6th.  Assuming we can overcome Everton (who will probably fall off slightly, given their small squad). 

But I still feel 7th or 8th is our more likely finishing position.

After today's inept display I can see Everton falling away. Chelsea are far from a cohesive unit. Arsenal with Walcott and Wilshere are better than I thought they would be a couple of months ago. City are a shambles.

So my prediction is:-

City / Spurs
Arsenal / Chelsea
Liverpool (6th).

One of Arsenal or Chelsea will miss out on CL football. I hope it's Chelsea because I'd love Abranovich (sp) to get a bloody nose for his arrogance,

Know what Ray, 4th will be sealed and done before that game!

I'm not that sure Martin. Even if we win all our games we're still depending on Spurs, Arsenal and Everton to drop points. They probably will but until Bale gets injured or commits some ridiculous read-card offence I don't see us overtaking Spurs.

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